Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

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MJL
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by MJL »

Thanks Boics and TimS.

Yeah, I really enjoy creating a range of different groups and forests but in truth - they are all just little trees grouped in pots ... at this stage not true, mature, ratifies Bonsai. I’ll get there one day and the tips that you all provide are helping greatly!

TimS - I love the idea and look of Larch forests but I can’t even get the bl@@dy single trees to grow where I live in Melbourne! I better learn how to grow one tree before I attempt a group of ‘em. Good luck with your groups when you get around to them.

Cheers,

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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by TimS »

I can’t help you much with Larch, being in Melbourne i’m on struggle street with them too! No issues with them in the ground, as soon as I put it in a pot it starts going backward. From what i can discover they hate root pruning so you have to be very gentle with root work and not cut back too much otherwise they die quickly. Also they need an extended dormancy at low temps so that’s never going to happen in suburban Melbourne.
Last edited by TimS on January 11th, 2019, 8:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by MJL »

Before I get to repotting my forest in the near future - I wanted to give it a trim. I am constantly staggered and find it amazing how much you can remove without disturbing the overall style too much and yet, improving structure and space for the future.

You can see from what I cut below, that I took quite a lot of height off but was able to return much of it with new leaders; improving taper. Yes, I took out some tops with early ramification but the new leads will improve style and potential ramification in future, I reckon anyway. In some cases, I took out little branches that were just too thick/high for the style. I would have done this in days past, I am learning and think I am going in the right direction; I feel more confident to do this type of work now I have a few years under my belt. Learning, learning ...

I don't think I'll lose any trees - albeit, I did crack the top the largest tree and if that dies, I'd bring the next branch up to form a new lead - not ideal but a contingency nonetheless.

I've tidied things up but there's still numerous elements to work on; some straight bits that could do with a bit of movement and of course, keep calm and ramify. I love this forest. It grows with my knowledge and as one of my first real attempts, I am emotionally attached to it.

I look forward to re-potting and then enjoying vigorous growth in spring and summer. Hopefully.

Cheers,

Mark

Here's as it was before the cut backs
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I wired new leads and took below off.
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It now looks like this.
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And I'll see if any of these strike in their little greenhouses. Why not try and make some little trees, nothing to lose.
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Have a good night everyone. :)
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by shibui »

I think that's a well planned forest. Good random spacing between trunks is not easy to achieve but this one looks fine.
There's a couple of trunks that are a bit straight for my taste but the forest will hide that I think.
I do like the major tree being so dominant and older than the rest. That looks great.

I thought I saw at least 1 top shoot heading in towards the other trees but maybe that's a trick of perspective? Even if there are a couple now that can easily be redirected in future.

Well done :tu:
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by Ryceman3 »

The dudes are back checking it all out again... just sayin’ :yes:
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by TimS »

shibui wrote: August 1st, 2019, 6:07 pm I think that's a well planned forest. Good random spacing between trunks is not easy to achieve but this one looks fine
This is what strikes me about this forest, the placement of the trunks is inherently pleasing to the eye, which i applaud with the use of such significantly larger primary tree.

Having seen it in person, it really does draw you in to spend some time exploring it. The photos don't do it justice and make it appear far more two dimensional than it really is; the visual depth created in front to back is lovely. Also the use of mounding and gradient in the soil/ planting levels helps it out as well, IMO it would look odd planted perfectly flat.

Just a really pleasing forest that benefits from a bit more space around it as you have done here. I love the sense that the big, old, misshapen (in a good way!) primary tree has given rise to the forest around it. Sort of like the feel you get from the Redwood 'Hyperion' towering over the other redwoods around it in photos.
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by MJL »

Thanks for the responses folks. Appreciated. :tu2:

Shibui and Tim - really appreciate your critiques. Shibui - the circled bits below bother me a tad (and indeed, some other straight bits too)... but I think I'll be able to put some subtle bends in them to be more harmonious to the overall design - and as you say, leaves will cover issues too. :whistle:
IMG_1179 (1).jpg
R3 - yep, your theory that I place little folk in settings that I like continues to be true. These three men own this setting; they won't let me move 'em! ;)

All good. Thanks again for your everyone's interest... and hey, good time's! Cricket is on the radio - (which I prefer to the TV ... something about memories of listening to the Ashes when I was young at nana and grandpa's place) ...but we're 3 down! :(
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by Raging Bull »

Great! This little forest is looking better all the time. :yes: To some extent I disagree with shibui when he says that some of the straighter trees are too straight. In a forest the trees are always straighter because they are all reaching for the light, and to get their share of light the best way is to go straight up. Anyway, that's my :2c: worth.
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by Ryceman3 »

MJL wrote: August 1st, 2019, 9:19 pm Cricket is on the radio - (which I prefer to the TV ... something about memories of listening to the Ashes when I was young at nana and grandpa's place) ...but we're 3 down! :(
Nothing to worry about MJL... as I keep telling the UK folk who seem to be pestering me with messages, “We’ve already won the Ashes!” Thank God for women’s cricket. :yes:
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by shibui »

Raging Bull wrote: August 1st, 2019, 9:28 pm Great! This little forest is looking better all the time. :yes: To some extent I disagree with shibui when he says that some of the straighter trees are too straight. In a forest the trees are always straighter because they are all reaching for the light, and to get their share of light the best way is to go straight up. Anyway, that's my :2c: worth.
There is no problem with disagreeing R.B. Everyone's opinion is important and valid.
While I agree that in many forests the trees can be straight to get to light you will see subtle differences in shape. Trees that have grown near an established tree may be straight but are rarely upright. Most lean away from the older tree to get the light they need.
Trees that are growing near and older tree that is twisted and bent usually have similar shape because the same influences that caused the shape of the original tree are still influencing the growth of subsequent younger trees - poor, shallow soil, prevailing winds, frequent storms, browsing, etc. those environmental influences are usually very long term or permanent so generations of trees are affected.
In a forest with straighter trees nearly all trees will be straight, especially the older, dominant trees.

Even just from an aesthetic point of view our human minds seem to like to see similar lines. Paintings, photos, sculptures and bonsai all seem to appear more harmonious and soothing when they have similar shapes and lines. Different lines and unusual angles produces feelings of tension and unease for most people.

MJL wrote: August 1st, 2019, 9:19 pm Shibui and Tim - really appreciate your critiques. Shibui - the circled bits below bother me a tad (and indeed, some other straight bits too)... but I think I'll be able to put some subtle bends in them to be more harmonious to the overall design
Those are also the bits that stand out most for me too. Not sure how thick those trunks are but be wary when attempting to bend JM. Wires can very easily leave marks on those smooth trunks, not only as the trees grow but also just because the wire is putting pressure on one side of the tree to force the bend. Wire marks on JM really stand out for many years so consider the possible negatives before rushing in to make changes. What can't be changed can be endured so if the risk is higher than the possible reward avoid the change. While it is good to strive for perfection sometimes we need to accept some imperfection and this group is still really good as it is.
Also look at the thinner trees. While they don't jump out now they will all grow and thicken and it will be easier to change them while still thin if that's what you choose to do.
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by MJL »

Thanks RB and Neil - love the ongoing discussion.

I went back and had a look at my posts (on this thread) in June 2018 - where I tried to put some bends in - as a relative newcomer - I’ve learned something - bends don’t stick easily! I took the wire off early - afraid of scars and eventually the trees are basically straight again. So a good tip might be to be more aggressive with your early bends and keep them in position as long as possible; perhaps even remove and reapply wire to avoid scars. In this way when you do remove wire/braces etc... even if trees straighten a little - you still keep some movement.

Still learning... and I hope posts like these help others too. I’ve learned so much from this community - be good to pass something back from time to time!

Be sure, I won’t take too many risks with this forest and while there are always points of improvement / I don’t lose sleep over them.

Cheers,

Mark
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by MJL »

A few more adjustments before the repot. I have taken out a few more straight lines. I've pushed the boundaries a bit too; in some cases I bent until I heard or saw a crack. :fc:

Please excuse my wiring - it ranges from average to awful. I'll use an excuse of proximity of trees and trying to bend without breaking little trigs/branchlets etc... but average I admit. Perhaps I should have dismantle when repotting and re-wire then? The messy wiring makes the bends and trunklines look more complex than they are.

Anyway ... I think it looks better again. The thick tree behind the main tree is now my main concern... and as Neil had noted, leaves will mask the issues.

Now I'll stop tinkering and wait a few weeks until buds swelling/burst and then, replant.
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by Ryceman3 »

I think the added bends help quite a bit to harmonise the whole thing MJL... definitely worth the effort.
My one and only Japanese maple has already begun leafing out (despite the cold spell in Melbourne over the last week or so)... but I think you’ll still be good to repot in a few weeks or so. ;)
Nice job.
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by TimS »

I think you’ve done well with those bends Mark, given how tricky it can be to put movement into JM once they thicken up.

Those bends has elevated the group for sure, and the leaf will hide the imperfections anyway.

I’ll be keen to see how repotting goes, if you can do it in any groups, of if it’s an individual tree job. One of my favourite tasks is repotting weirdly
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Re: Japanese Maple forest.... two into one?

Post by 鸕盆栽 Gamauji Bonsai »

The main branch on the larger tree seems far to straight. I recommend removing it in the spring and the tree should compensate with some more usable growth.
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