AusBonsai

Hi,

Purchased this tree short while ago at one of the sales, was going to give it a style but am unsure of direction. The existing branches are fairly thick, and not really at the angle I would have liked (also has some wire damage), also the roots are uneven and very flat. Suggestions would be appreciated.

Should I defoliate the tree now to give a better view of the structure?

Craig, I would not touch this tree now at all. Wait until late winter. You might have to pull the old leaves off because they hold on to them.
Beech do not respond well to normal defoliation. However there is a defoliation techinque that works well.
The timing is very important.
Towards the end of the season when there is still potential growing time left (early april here) you cut off the leaves but you leave a small triangular shaped peice of leaf at base of the the stem. It's very impotant that you remove the tip of every branch ( at least the large bud at the end of the branch ) and you defoliate the entire tree.
If all goes well (and a nice healthy tree like yours) it will produce hundreds of buds all over the place. If you have timed it correctly, these buds will remain dormant until the following spring.
Thin the buds as you see fit and keep well shaded.
Prune in winter and remember to pinch soft new growth as usual for beech.

As far as styling....well the tree will tell you but I would say prune rather than wire most of the time.

treeman wrote:Craig, I would not touch this tree now at all. Wait until late winter. You might have to pull the old leaves off because they hold on to them.
Beech do not respond well to normal defoliation. However there is a defoliation techinque that works well.
The timing is very important.
Towards the end of the season when there is still potential growing time left (early april here) you cut off the leaves but you leave a small triangular shaped peice of leaf at base of the the stem. It's very impotant that you remove the tip of every branch ( at least the large bud at the end of the branch ) and you defoliate the entire tree.
If all goes well (and a nice healthy tree like yours) it will produce hundreds of buds all over the place. If you have timed it correctly, these buds will remain dormant until the following spring.
Thin the buds as you see fit and keep well shaded.
Prune in winter and remember to pinch soft new growth as usual for beech.

As far as styling....well the tree will tell you but I would say prune rather than wire most of the time.

Interesting comments on defoliating Treeman. I have a beech here I was wondering about defoliating so might give this a go. Glad your in Melbourne so April suits me. The tree was pruned and repotted last winter so looking to get ramification on it this year. Thanks for the advice.

Josh.

Thanks treeman for suggestions will keep in mind for future. I have already partially defoliated the tree so that the structure is visible... oops hopefully ok.

Was looking around on the web and seems to be a lot of conflicting ideas, some say no, Walter Pall on the other hand seems to defoliate his in summer, as long as the tree is healthy, with fantastic results. Also found another link below that talks about partial defoliation. Figured the partial defoliation was somewhere in between, also like the proposed extension of the buds further back on the branches.

Will fertilize and continue watering and see what happens. Think I will reduce the height of the tree now as well.

http://www.bonsai4me.com/SpeciesGuide/B ... runing.htm

Here's the latest picture, was studying the branches earlier and perhaps not as bad as originally thought, need some pruning and thinning out below.

Some nice aspects to that tree Craig.
Maybe just shorten t he top trunk section to improve taper. to me it is too long and straightish

Can you ground layer or root graft to improve Nebari?

Ken

Thanks Ken, think ground layering is the way to go. Have been looking at the tree and have decided on a front, and reduced the height and branches to create taper. Now to leave the tree to grow, and will look to layering in spring.

Nice sketch!
This will be good to watch.
I look forward to your updates.

Hi,

Quick update on the defoliation. As you can see below the tree responded with vigor. Over the last month, the majority of the internal buds sprouted and started growing. Will thin out a little to allow some light to enter, and leave the growth to harden for the rest of the season... spring time ground layering

Nice Response to your treatment
Don't you just love it when it works

Ken

Ground layering done, followed Ray M's approach, now the wait begins. Technically everything went to plan so happy.

Really battled stripping the bark and green cambium layer beneath, was really tough. Is this normal for beech, or perhaps due to the tree not actively growing yet?

Treeman's recent layer post has made me really eager to have a look at the beech I did around the same time. Is it too early to separate now, was originally planning middle August?

Have seen a couple thin roots sticking out below the pot around the layer, hope sufficient to separate. Not getting hopes up too high.

I did a very similar layer to a Celtis. At about this time I very carefully teased the soil away from the layer to find I'd been successful. If not successful, my plan was to replace the soil and grow for another season.

Adam

Fantastic work there Craig,game plan looks on song..well done
Anthony

I have to agree with the compliments. The tree is coming along as to your plan and should become a nice tree with some years on it.

Is it too early to separate now, was originally planning middle August?

Middle of August is only a couple of weeks away Craig. Not sure whether there is any advantage but I'd be inclined to wait another week or 2. I think Webos has the right idea. Take off the collar and scrape away some of the potting mix to see if there are roots. I don't think you'll be able to get right up close to the trunk because you've used Ray's mud mix but you should still be able to see the roots coming out of it into the potting mix.
I have always been astounded at how few roots a layer needs to survive after removal from the parent.

Good luck