THE JWP PROJECT

[Ryceman3]

What can I say ... I'm a sucker for a project and growing stuff from seed rates highly on my things to get motivated about. I plan to continue with propagating JBP and a few other bits and pieces too, but when the prospect of creating some seed-grown Japanese White Pine came onto the radar I was keen to diversify.
I really like JWP as bonsai, and was completely in awe of some of the older, mature versions I saw in Japan a number of years ago that nudged my motivation to try growing them. The problem I have though when I look to get a JWP to try here is grafting. I have trouble getting passed the graft union, I can't overlook the taper issues that are common at these sites or the obvious scars/bulges/weirdness that I see. I am sure there are many well grafted trees but I haven't come across any being sold as pre-bonsai, so I keep walking by.
Clearly the way to avoid these issues is to get a non-grafted JWP ... on its own roots ... easier said than done! I've only ever seen a couple available that I think would be suited to bonsai and those were going for a price I couldn't justify. It has been broadly stated that JWP don't perform well when they aren't grafted, the root system is weak(er) compared to say JBP and they are MUCH slower to develop. They don't seem to remain healthy for long is the anecdotal summary. All of that might be true, but with seed available (a shout out to TimS... ) and a chance to try and create some ungrafted JWP with the goal of bonsai from the very beginning, I feel like it's ripe for me to put all that to the test myself. The only sure-fire way of never getting anywhere is never starting the journey, so time to get the seed trays out and get busy this winter! I'll be logging my JWP from seed journey in this thread and with any luck in 10 years or so it will contain a few pics of some nice little JWP bonsai. In the meantime, here's a pic of the seed that I have right now ...

JWP Seed IG_01.jpg

I have a few to play with so will be trying a couple of different germination techniques. How successful I am at getting seedlings I guess will then determine how experimental I get with growing strategies etc.
If you've got an inkling to have a go at JWP from scratch and a few spare bucks maybe reach out to TimS on this thread
https://www.ausbonsai.com.au/forum/view ... 73#p303973
and play along with me ... it's always fun waiting to see what happens.

[TimS]

Looking forward to seeing what you can achieve with the white pines mate! Hopefully you'll get a bit of a different challenge and we'll all get to learn from your excellent pine knowledge and experience along the way

[PeachSlices]

I will join in from NSW, Will do some testing aswell.

Simon

[BirchMan]

If anyone can do it you can!

[Raniformis]

What variety are these seeds? I've got several hundred of the glauca variety and popped half a dozen straight from the cone with no problems. The Googles say they may need stratification once they harden off but we all know how wrong the interwebs can be.

From a commercial perspective it makes sense to use grafted material, hard to maintain integrity selling something in Qld for example when you know they won't do well in a warmer environment.

[Ryceman3]

What variety are these seeds?

Not 100% on that, I'm gonna say something pretty stock standard. Whenever you grow from seed though you will get plenty of variation in the seedlings as it is not cloning the parent like cuttings, layering etc... but I don't think the tree that provided the cones was a specific cultivar.

From a commercial perspective it makes sense to use grafted material, hard to maintain integrity selling something in Qld for example when you know they won't do well in a warmer environment.

Of course! If it didn't make commercial sense it wouldn't be common practice for JWP nursery stock to be grafted because it's adding man hours/risk/extra care and resources etc. I guess the nurseries aren't thinking bonsai as a potential end game for the tree. You never know, I might end up finding out exactly why they do it!!

[TimS]

What variety are these seeds?.

I collected them all from several Glauca white pines, but as Ryan says they will (likely) not show the same characteristics.

Years ago i purchased an un-grafted JWP, but sold it to another member. I didn't particularly struggle with it, just at the time i wasn't into pines enough to appreciate what i actually had.

There is a lot of comments about how they don't survive well on their roots, but the Japanese seem to be able to do it so why shouldn't we?

[Patmet]

What variety are these seeds?.

I collected them all from several Glauca white pines, but as Ryan says they will (likely) not show the same characteristics.

Years ago i purchased an un-grafted JWP, but sold it to another member. I didn't particularly struggle with it, just at the time i wasn't into pines enough to appreciate what i actually had.

There is a lot of comments about how they don't survive well on their roots, but the Japanese seem to be able to do it so why shouldn't we?

I'm guessing it just comes down to what your local climate is. I've personally never seen a white pine in Western Australia, grafted or un-grafted.

I tried germinating seeds a couple of years ago to no avail. I'm not confident they would grow well here, but it would still be interesting to find out myself. Getting decent seed in this state is the hard part..