RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

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RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby miyagiman » June 22nd, 2016, 9:15 pm

This is a radiata pine that I purchased from a nursery somewhere about 12 years ago as a stock plant, it may have even been at one of the nurseries in Macedon, but I can't be sure. It had some reverse taper, which I am still working on growing out. But the twist in the trunk halfway up attracted my attention, so thought it was worth a go.
Over the years it has ramified from primary single branches to tertiary as you see it now, it's not a perfect tree I know, but I have learnt a lot about radiata's, and have had some great fun with it along the way.
I cleaned it out last week and started wiring, and then thought I should take some pictures of its progression. I should take more pictures of my trees, as it is good to look back at how they used to be, and how different they are now.
The tree finished up pretty nice I thought, even though it still has some faults, some I can work at, others I will have to put up with. It is 410 mm in height from top of pot.
The photos will give a bit of an idea of my work, but I had already wired the first branch prior to thinking about photos.
Miyagiman.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Boics » June 22nd, 2016, 9:22 pm

Looks fantastic from the top.
"Your work" is great!

How do you plan on addressing the reverse taper?
One of the fabulous things about growing bonsai is as you get old and decrepit your trees get old and beautiful
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Ryceman3 » June 22nd, 2016, 10:14 pm

I've seen some pretty crap wiring jobs on some trees ... and I have to be honest... This is NOT one of them! You should be happy with the result, outstanding technique - I am in awe. :shock: :tu: :worship:
"NO CUTS, NO GLORY"
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Kevin » June 22nd, 2016, 11:33 pm

Hello Miyagiman,

I'm with Boics and Ryceman, great work over the years obviously on a challenging specimen.

I too am interested in your techniques in overcoming 'reverse taper'. You mentioned growing it out? Can you please elaborate on that principle. Also, as a novice bonsai enthusiast - can reverse taper be corrected with the scalpel, that is, cutting it out?

Thanks for showing us and interested in your techniques to correct the reverse taper.

Kevin
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby melbrackstone » June 23rd, 2016, 10:14 am

Wow, that's impressive!

Newbie question, would it be possible to use the techniques like "damage to the thinner part to make it thicker?"
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby miyagiman » June 23rd, 2016, 10:50 am

Firstly, thank you all for the positive comments, they give me a boost knowing that this tree appears to be heading in the right direction.
BUT; the reverse taper is now my focus, and is a topic that needs sharing with you.
When I purchased this tree, the reverse taper was very extreme, even to the point that in its first few years, I screwed a small piece of "driftwood" to the "front" of the lower trunk to "disguise" it. As time went on, and the tree ramified, the reverse taper was slowly growing out of it, and the lower trunk has thickened. This is the continuing method I will use, it appears to have become a time thing.
Over the following development of the tree, I read lots and talked to lots of people about the taper problem, and they all talked about the remedies they have heard of, but mostly never tried. The ones who did try the hammering and the slicing, ALL had negative feedback. It either didn't work, or, damaged the tree visually in the long run. It appears you need to be an expert in this field to be successful, and sadly, most of us are not that yet, including myself.
I don't regret buying this tree, I love it. But if reverse taper is a point of concern when looking at a tree to buy, then don't buy it, because the road ahead will be very long.
However, I am still continuing to feed and grow the tree and eventually, one day the lower trunk will get a bit thicker and the old bark is developing nicely enough over time to give me a result I can cope with.
So, patience and time. That is the old way and apparently the best way.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Matt S » June 23rd, 2016, 10:53 am

Hi Miyagiman.

Excellent work on this tree. After you've answered all the questions about correcting the reverse taper, I have a couple about how you got such beautiful small, even needles across the tree (maybe this should be a new topic?).

I have a couple of collected trees that I'm building the framework on, but the constant flushes of growth has me a little puzzled. Do you pluck/pinch/prune the same way you would a Japanese black pine (i.e. a pine with 2 flushes of growth a season)? Your tree has me really excited about the possibilities of radiatas!

Matt.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Lane » June 23rd, 2016, 12:17 pm

I'm with Matt, I would really appreciate if you'd share your technique for needle length reduction and refinement.

Perhaps you could ask the Taiga the Japanese expert visiting Melbourne soon regarding the reverse taper?

Nice tree regardless.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby anthonyW » June 23rd, 2016, 4:12 pm

Hi Miyagiman

Yes a pretty tree with a glaring fault,as you have stated and shown,by the tone of your post you are still annoyed and fair enough,its all there but "except" and we all have those trees so you are not alone.
What I have here is some ideas for you,which I believe will take your eyes off the fault as such, stop the fault from worsening and illusion of hiding it for now and fixing your eyes on other focal points because of interest as they say.

Firstly starting with the foliage/branches that high for thickness of trunk straight through exacerbated the problem I m afraid,especially having those 3 branches that close, even at those correct areas of bend and nice movement,frankly you have too much power/growth there,muscling up the that area causing the problem in 12 years,and I m afraid too say thats not going to repair a real lot in the next 12 years leaving those 3 branches there,in fact it will get worse in my opinion.

In saying all that,not all is lost,in fact we can stop it and in time reverse it in a quicker time frame from our actions and alot of the time a better dynamic tree.

So here we have some ideas for you...again thankyou for your time and good luck with your tree its always your call..hope you don t mind me thinking out aloud and... you do have a lovely Radiata tree very much persisting with

Cheers Anthony

(can a Mod please turn the pics around,I tried....thanks)

phpyQvYRFPM.jpg


phpQ4Tyw0PM.jpg

Removed problem..illusion of breaking up taper...and another focal point/interest

phpeEK19FPM.jpg

Roots exposed give nice fat/illusion and head and dropped branch a another focal point/interest
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Last edited by anthonyW on June 23rd, 2016, 4:15 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby miyagiman » June 23rd, 2016, 8:33 pm

Hi Matt and MacGyver, thank you, and yes, I will address the methods I have used to work the foliage.
However, the methods I use will create more questions and cries of "wrong" and horror. But I will go down the path of explaining shortly what works for me. I have a larger 50 odd year old radiata that I will post a photo of tomorrow, with which I use the same methods, and it seems to be heading in the right direction.
I will post the photos and methods together, tomorrow.
Hi Anthony, thank you for your comments and drawings, man, you have been busy. Your thoughts are also things that I have considered in the past, but have always procrastinated due to wanting to stick with the chosen path, and wanting to see it through, as such. But, now that you have explained it and backed it up with drawings, I will give some serious thought to these possible remedies. I will keep you all posted on any decisions made.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Matt S » June 24th, 2016, 5:36 pm

Hi Miyagiman

I look forward to hearing about your methods. Don't worry if they are unconventional, you've obviously found something that works well on your trees in your backyard. It's up to others whether they to follow your experiences or not.

Once again, we're really lucky to have so many people who are willing to share their experiences and knowledge.

Matt.
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Reece » June 25th, 2016, 10:06 am

Reverse taper or not it's awesome to see a radiata with fine branching and small needles like this. I was told by someone that a well chosen, well placed rock can sometimes disguise reverse taper while you try and grow it out over a long time. Just another option.....

Great work mate.

Subscribed....

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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Daluke » June 26th, 2016, 9:02 am

Nice tree! Good luck
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby anttal63 » October 11th, 2016, 4:00 pm

Looks awesome Dave !!! :cool:
Regards Antonio:
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Re: RADIATA PINE WIRING PROGRESSION

Postby Daluke » October 11th, 2016, 4:46 pm

Since reading this tree, I think I saw this tree in the flesh at a BSV night? If so, let me say that the tree looks amazing in the flesh and I don't think the photo gives it justice. Any issues detailed in the post were only noticeable because I was aware of it beforehand. In an exhibition I don't think you'd notice.
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