Excited......

[Waltron]

Another A-hole who thinks biosecurity doesn't apply to them, shame we can't ship you off like was done to Johnny Depp and his dogs.

Disgusting behavior but no surprise from what I am learning in this community

Wow.

What conclusions we like to draw when both our knowledge bank, and our ability to say “I don’t know” are lacking. I like to ask myself – is what I’m thinking actually based in any factual reality or am I filling in the blanks, judgementally?

Shakespeare famously wrote “The fool doth think he is wise, but the wise man knows himself to be a fool.” Try starting from the assumption that you don’t know the answer. I am sure we can all remember situations where we have inadvertently created an illusion of knowledge because we didn’t want to admit to not knowing, or not knowing enough.

In regards to disgusting behaviour, a bit of self-reflection before appointing yourself judge and jury in the ignorant keyboard-warrior kangaroo court may go a long way. I don't appreciate having my character illegitimately smeared by an unknowing soapbox clown.

Would you like to share these loopholes that allow you to import whatever you like without going thru appropriate quarantine channels or continue to throw abuse at those who view our nations flora and fauna with respect

Your joking right? You called wrcmad an arsehole.

[wrcmad]

Nice use of framing to attack my character again... fitting tactic given your previous Barnaby excerpt. But I won’t be goaded.
Let me deconstruct it for you.

Would you like to share these loopholes...."

No, as mentioned in previous posts.

...that allow you to import whatever you like without going thru appropriate quarantine channels...

Again, you are drawing wild conclusions from assumptions that are not based on any factual reality. What makes you an authority on “appropriate quarantine” channels?
While a nice attempt at burden play, it has already been indicated above by some knowledgeable members that there are various tiers/channels of regulation regarding importation.

...or continue to throw abuse at those ...

Continue to throw abuse? Are you kidding?
Another lame attempt at character assassination used as a defence.
My singular response was merely retaliatory to your initial attack and name calling. Again, a bit of self-reflection by you should obviate exactly who continues to throw abuse.

...who view our nations flora and fauna with respect

Another good try at framing which I won’t be provoked by.
Disregarding all facts and desperately attempting to cast my character as the disrespectful and evil one based only on fanciful assumptions, and trying to take the moral high ground can be easily gleaned from The Leftist’s Handbook of Debating 101. You’ll have to try harder.

When you can have a rational discussion based on facts and known quantities, rather than an emotional rant based on nothing more than unsubstantiated assumptions and falsities, then I may be able to respond a bit more seriously.

Until then, have a nice day.

[Beano]

I’d love to know for my own benefit, and I never abused you. I find it puzzling that you won’t share something that could help the bonsai community. Why would you even post the topic if not willing to be questioned about it?

[treeman]

Biosecurity isn't simply a money making scheme treeman

It's a huge part of it. As I said, there was no biosecurity years ago. I know this because 40 years ago or so, orchid growers could place orders from India, South America and other places and the plants arrived packed in crates with soil, moss and forest mulch still attached to the roots and often the bugs that came along with them. As far as I now, there are no pests which were introduced via that method that are still around today or are any kind of major problem. That's not to say it isn't possible but the fact is that didn't happen. And I'm not talking about one box, I'm talking about thousands from all over the place. Every vegetable, every fruit and almost every ornamental plant, tree, shrub or flower we have in this country have been brought in either by seed or by live plant in soil many decades ago. None of them went through quarantine. Where are all the unmanageable deadly diseases? Now of course, if you want to import orchids for example, the cost is so prohibitive that only large nurseries can afford it and then they need to charge huge prices just to make a small profit. All they (the plants need) is to be dipped into an insecticide bath and released, but no, they now need to be kept for some months in an expensive quarantine facility where some nincompoop who has absolutely no idea what he is looking at is paid (by the importer) to check them and when he ''thinks'' that all is well they are released for another fee of course. Some people had their own quarantine houses but the government saw fit to charge them huge amounts (thousands!) for the ''privilege'' to have it on their own property that now it is beyond affordability and we must use the government's own set up, only to be charged whatever they want. They have you by the short and curlies and they know it.
So no, not all money making but a fair amount is nothing but.

There are plenty of pests and diseases that thus far haven't arrived in Aus that are only kept out via due process.

Rather than due process, I suspect more like pure luck. There isn't the man-power necessary to inspect the tsunami of containers arriving here and can you just imagine the constipated ports if they did? The whole system would collapse. But I guess they need to be seen to be doing something.

[wrcmad]

I’d love to know for my own benefit, and I never abused you. I find it puzzling that you won’t share something that could help the bonsai community. Why would you even post the topic if not willing to be questioned about it?

My post topic was about a tree species I had been trying to procure, unsuccessfully, for a number of years, and my excitement at having finally been able to obtain it, and my willingness to start propagating to share with other members - not really any different to most other posts by members of their own trees.

It then degraded into an unsubstantiated and personal pasting of me, over unrelated particulars, that were never even raised by myself.

I understand your questioning the lack information sharing. I am usually open to sharing any info available to me - and that is well displayed in the threads of this forum.
However, there are some circumstances where a lot of time, effort and money has gone into acquiring certain information that is otherwise not readily forthcoming. When this knowledge presents potential opportunity, it is often not shared straight away. This statement does not only apply to myself - for a good example on this forum, see here:
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=23627&start=0&hilit=tokoname.
This example may seem trivial, but fact is while a number of members here have visited the great workshops, and at the time were even importing pots by the pallet load, I had to take myself to Tokoname, and find out the hard way that most of the great pottery workshops are not located along any of the tourist trails.

Regards

[Beano]

Ok I understand. Thank you.

[MJL]

As with my initial reply to this thread - I cast no aspersion either way - I am however, intrigued by the mystery and also respect the situation not to directly ask nor for the info to be provided.

As I was intrigued and I had no idea what Ueno Green Club is - when I looked - I noted it is comprised of numerous facilities including general and science museums and a zoo.

Now, I have no idea about quarantine and the various aspects therein but I can imagine numerous different and specific channels aligned to science, museums and zoos that may still adhere to import protocols but are different to a process that may be applied if I was importing something myself. Or maybe not.

I might be way off the mark intrigue hooked me so had to have a guess.

No response is required - I just post my thoughts on a lunch break as sometimes what seems obvious is in fact - not - and the answer sits somewhere left of centre and outside of general thought and assumptions.


Bonsai teaches me patience.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Beano]

All I know about quarantine is from trying to import a pair of Siamese fighting fish from Indonesia about 14 years ago. Expensive ++, I had to use a licensed live fish importer, who then had to keep them quarantined for 2 further weeks after hitting our shores. You can’t do it without the expensive license that the importer held. Wasn’t worth it, wouldn’t do it again, but they were gorgeous fish.

Otherwise plant wise, familiar with papaya fruit fly in Cairns, which seems to have been long forgotten about, fire ants and electric ants which I’ve never seen anywhere, and most recently not being able to mail order plants from outside SA in the Myrtaceae family. But you can buy seeds on eBay. From anywhere.

That’s the only reason I wanted to know... just to see if it was worth me bothering... I remember Neli years ago bringing a whole suitcase of bonsai back to South Africa from Japan. And she could. No rules! I was jealous.

[wrcmad]

As I was intrigued and I had no idea what Ueno Green Club is - when I looked - I noted it is comprised of numerous facilities including general and science museums and a zoo.

Ueno is a district in Tokyo city.
Ueno Park is a large public Park which houses the facilities you mention, including the zoo, half a dozen museums, a couple of shrines, a temple, a Starbucks, and the Metropolitan Art Museum where the Kokufu exhibition is held.
Ueno Green Club is a building which boarders Ueno Park (but is outside of the park), and is Associated with the Nippon Bonsai Society, whose headquarters are basically across the road. The Green club has a bonsai sales area, which expands exponentially during Kokufu.

[Mbunro]

Note to self: never play scrabble with wrcmad

[melbrackstone]

I'm glad you had a successful and fruitful trip!

[Grant Bowie]

Please give us your impression of the material versus the shimpaku that already exists in Australia.

For shoo-in growers this should be exciting material.

Grant

[Elmer]

Im extremely suprised without a post sanitary certificate,methyl bromide treatment that is pretty harsh on sone species plus the no soil import so itd usually bare rooted into coconut husk or some inert material all which junipers aint keen on +12 months min in a approved quarantine facility. You certainly found a loop hole then.

Yes. None of that was neccessary.
One dictionary definition of "loophole" is "make arrow slits in (a wall)."
I say no more.

I could dissect your two posts towards me but you think you know more than everyone including someone you do not know at all.. You however are well known so that makes it all OK apparently.. Enjoy you vaunted status and loopholes until AQIS come knocking

[Matthew]

Please give us your impression of the material versus the shimpaku that already exists in Australia.

For shoo-in growers this should be exciting material.

Grant

I too like Grant would be interested to hear impressions .

[bki]

please describe the soil it's in too.