A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 20th, 2018, 10:43 am

LLK wrote:There's a heck of a lot more to Mauro's work than you saw in a single example. If you can, go and see his demo at the Illawarra Bonsai Society.
I am lucky enough to have had a Scots pine given a new lease on bonsai beauty by him, last Saturday. When I've got photos of it I'll post them here.
It seems to me that some people on this forum enjoy a nice, fiery argument. Well, OK, but see to it that it has a solid base and isn't a rehash of things said many times before.

Lisa


Nothing to do with Mauro, It's modern bonsai culture.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 20th, 2018, 10:48 am

MJL wrote:Hmmmm....
Art and the beholder.jpg

or perhaps as one who is still learning ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQ4yd2W50No

:)

Nothing to do with art either. It's more about fashion conformity.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 20th, 2018, 10:51 am

Peter KB wrote:I was lucky enough to attend on Tuesday night a great opportunity to watch an artist at work, the Bonsai that was created was far from “formulaic”. Many thanks to the Illawarra Club.


Completely formulaic and designed to fit a blueprint.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 20th, 2018, 10:52 am

Qitianlong wrote:I think it looks fantastic!


No one is denying that. So does every single Ferrari model.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Jow » June 20th, 2018, 5:12 pm

Natural? While the tree doesn't really grab me, I think within the range of nature many forms are present if you want to find them.

A tree from a local park. Someone forgot to tell it that it's swept down branches are formulaic.

For me the beauty of bonsai is the vast array of different approaches. If we all did it the same it wouldn't be half as interesting.

Joe
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 20th, 2018, 5:47 pm

Jow"


Natural? While the tree doesn't really grab me, I think within the range of nature many forms are present if you want to find them.


Exactly. That is my very point.

A tree from a local park. Someone forgot to tell it that it's swept down branches are formulaic.


Trees aren't formulaic. Modern bonsai formation is. Also, your example is not very inspirational IMO. We want to get our inspiration from the best nature has to offer.

For me the beauty of bonsai is the vast array of different approaches. If we all did it the same it wouldn't be half as interesting.


Who is doing all these vast array of different approaches? I don't see them. I just see more of the same. We are all doing it the same. Most of it (not all but most) is not interesting to me.
I should qualify that by saying that it seems many native enthusiasts are abandoning the formula. They are taking their inspiration from trees not bonsai.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Jow » June 20th, 2018, 6:03 pm

Some interesting points Mike. I look forward to delving deeper into this with your presentation at the convention.


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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Rory » June 20th, 2018, 9:09 pm

treeman wrote:They are taking their inspiration from trees not bonsai.


To me this is the single most valuable advice you can give someone today. Yet it is still misunderstood. :crybye:
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Sammy D » June 20th, 2018, 9:33 pm

Once again Treeman :worship: :worship:

100 percent agree with you.
One thing I will say though is that it is hard to break away from the Japanese approach to styling.
It really takes some effort and natural inspiration and constantly reminding one's self.
Biggest rule. Branches up first. Simple rule but still a challenge to follow.
A stick in a pot is better than no stick at all. Remember even the best bonsai started as a stick.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby wrcmad » June 20th, 2018, 9:40 pm

treeman wrote:
Qitianlong wrote:I think it looks fantastic!


No one is denying that. So does every single Ferrari model.

Good. Settled for me then. I'll stick with the Ferrari trees.
I like Ferrari's too, as do most others, because they look exquisite.

I am quite confused as to what you think is good, as you only seem to criticise everything and say it all looks s#!t.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Pup » June 20th, 2018, 10:58 pm

Many many years ago the late John Y Naka advised us to make our trees. To look like trees, not Bonsai.

The emphasis being TREE.

Ps I like ferraris but I love Mustangs.
Last edited by Pup on June 20th, 2018, 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Rory » June 21st, 2018, 9:12 am

wrcmad wrote:
treeman wrote:
Qitianlong wrote:I think it looks fantastic!


No one is denying that. So does every single Ferrari model.

Good. Settled for me then. I'll stick with the Ferrari trees.
I like Ferrari's too, as do most others, because they look exquisite.

I am quite confused as to what you think is good, as you only seem to criticise everything and say it all looks s#!t.


Awww, come on Brad. :beer: :) In a lot of ways Mike is like you are with Tokoname pots. He is critical, but appreciates a unique and different piece. Just like you would probably skew your nose up at a mass produced chinese pot that is factory produced with the same formula over and over.

If you click on Treemans profile and scroll through the history of Mikes comments, you will see his comments are actually insightful (often critically thinking, which is what I want when I present my material). In my eyes, he is like Neil and Grant (where are you Grant...). Neil and Mike are cornerstones of this site giving both critical and very helpful advice. Mike is more blunt, but strongly attempts to steer newbies on the right path sooner than later. I admire them both immensely for their tireless and unselfish contributions. If you read each thread, you will notice that Mike so often presents his argument with logic.

Mike is the Spock of bonsai. Neil can be Captain Kirk. Some people don't like his green-blooded insight and logic. :mrgreen: But if it wasn't for Spocks insight, Captain Kirk would not have succeeded on gut instincts alone.
Last edited by Rory on June 21st, 2018, 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby Keep Calm and Ramify » June 21st, 2018, 10:12 am

wrcmad wrote:
I am quite confused as to what you think is good, as you only seem to criticise everything and say it all looks s#!t.


:wave: wrcmad - Check out Treeman's post "Some Bonsai that I like" for this answer. This post was an open invitation for others to update, discuss & continually learn.
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 21st, 2018, 11:37 am

Rory wrote:. Some people don't like his green-blooded insight and logic. :mrgreen: .


:lol: :lol:
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Re: A night with Mauro Stemberger at Illawarra Bonsai Society

Postby treeman » June 21st, 2018, 12:04 pm

wrcmad wrote:

I am quite confused as to what you think is good, as you only seem to criticise everything and say it all looks s#!t.


I'm just as critical (believe me) if not more so, of my own trees which I have worked on for 30 years or so. Most of them have been formed with all the traditional techniques we have learned from the Japanese. Some of the younger deciduous stuff (10 years or so) are giving me more satisfaction than the older boring formulaic trees. They can't really be changed now, (or at least not without great difficulty) so I persist in the direction they are headed. For a while they may give a certain visual pleasure, but that is usually short lived simply because their future is so predictable. The ones I can change I am changing.
What do I think is good? Many, many things. Some of the Japanese conifer masterpieces are superb, some are downright repulsive to me now. Most are just plain tiresome and un-inspirational whereas 20 years ago I would probably have knelt down before them in awe.
When I was young I loved Ferraris, now they don't rate very highly. Taste changes and matures over time. Subtlety starts to have more weight and depth. Slickness and finish, less so. More shallow, less meaningful. Certainly less potential.
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