Boics Allocasuarina Torulosa Progression

[Rory]

If you are happy with the height, then ignore my comments... but I think this would look better being taller than it is at the moment

[treebuilder]

Update.



1. I can see from the photo that some of the branches need wiring to more sympathetically align to their peers.
2. Beyond this I have been working on ramification via much pinching.
3. I'm also trying to balance areas and negate the apical dominance of this species.

Always happy to hear thoughts, suggestions, views.

Hi Boics,
I like the progession of your casuarina, it's going well.

Re; Casuarina traing; the way I am being shown to grow Casuarina is
that branch development must be the First priority. Selecting and training

the primary and then seconary branching first. It is truely "textbook" stuff

but with Casuarina it Is necessary.
Developing some more thickness on your lower branches and then selecting

and growing secondary branching over the next few years, as with the other

branches just need more secondaries.

Once branching is set out then that is Most of the hard work done.

The way to get Casuarina to look like "those" in the books all the needles

on branching needs to be removed and the aim is to develop clusters near the

ends of each branch. Removing all downwards growth and all growth Not near

the ends of branches will keep the Casuarina in good shape and give the

appearance we strive towards.

Casuarina can be trained other ways but this is the way the Indonesians do

it and They have great success doing it.It does take some time and it's

something not rushed but worth it in terms of doing the Species Justice.

Halfway down is the casuarina section of Robert Steven's write up.
http://robert-steven.ofbonsai.org/articles/
On the drawing i didn't like the bottom branch so i circled to remove?
On the tips of all the brown branching will be clusters of Green foliage,
and probably would have front branch somewhere depending on overall
projected(final) appearance.

tb4boics.jpg

I hope you can find this useful to you as you work on your Casuarina,
Good luck with it,

TB

[Boics]

Thanks for the advise TB and appreciate the comments.
I must admit that I had missed your post so sorry for the late reply.

Here is a brief update not a whole lot changed since the last post but the density of branching / needles is increasing slowly but surely.

I think for some branches I do need to employ some harsher tactics / chops - the tree seems to be very apically dominant.
It's actually hard to thicken things up down low but I suppose some harsher treatment up top will fix this!

[treebuilder]

CASP1050730.JPG

all good,
With Casuarina in Training you need to allow them to extend shoots with out pinching and cutting . So you allow the red arrows free run never reducing them until they are say pencil size or bigger so they are capable of not dying back when cut. By allowing red shoots to grow strong they become small branches(orange) and when cut back will shoot again .This way to build all primaries,secondaries and tertiary branching. Then once a set of branching has been built /set in place , ramification of foliage(purple) can be worked on by pinching shoots when very young. Your tree shows much promise,keep at it.

[Boics]

Thanks once again TB.

I like the information and views you have given here.
Very helpful.

I'll try and put them into action and will continue to update the thread with my progress.

What are your views around re-potting, timing etc?

[Ryceman3]

Great tree Boics,
A lot of development in just a few years. Got one of these at the last BSV sale at about the same level of development as yours was in 2012 so I find a lot of inspiration (and information) in this post. It's now sitting happily with my Littoralis and Verticillata Allo's waiting for some attention. Thanks for sharing!

[Ryceman3]

PS: any thoughts on trunk chopping below shoots/ green? I've got a leader I want to reduce but unsure of back budding potential, I think it should be OK yeah?

[Boics]

Thanks Ryceman.

My thoughts on your cut back are that it will likely explode with new growth and give you options..
Having said this I wouldn't risk it.. My recommendation is to cut right back to the nearest green during the more active months.

I think this will de-risk your chop and I believe will still stimulate some new growth where you want it anyway.
I've found that when a tree is active it throws a lot more options so this bit is important IMO.

Good luck.

[treebuilder]

Repotting Casuarina can be variable but you don't really want to repot anything when there will be no active growth soon following. They can be repotted at different times of year depending on local conditions and general aftercare.You can be a little harsh on them they go alright.You can cut past green but as always it's up to your experience and good judgement if you should.

[Ryceman3]

My thoughts on your cut back are that it will likely explode with new growth and give you options..
Having said this I wouldn't risk it.. My recommendation is to cut right back to the nearest green during the more active months.
Good luck.

Repotting Casuarina can be variable but you don't really want to repot anything when there will be no active growth soon following. They can be repotted at different times of year depending on local conditions and general aftercare.You can be a little harsh on them they go alright.You can cut past green but as always it's up to your experience and good judgement if you should.

Thanks to you both for the input. I have already cut back to the nearest green about a month ago, no joy with budding below that but clearly the tree isn't active now... It's a bit chilly! Will wait until Spring to reassess and hopefully witness new growth pushing below. If not, might just chop and see (there is a second leader option if it ends badly!)
Keep updating this thread Boics, watching it with interest.
Cheers!
R

[Rory]

It's actually hard to thicken things up down low but I suppose some harsher treatment up top will fix this!

Torulosa wants to grow vertically upwards as much as possible to produce stronger upward growth for maximum sun exposure. The best way to thicken your lower branches, is actually to not bend them down initially. This slows down the growth quickly in the lower branches because it forces the energy into the upwards higher growth up top. Casuarina wont waste energy into branches that are going to grow downwards, more so than the branches up top that will reach for the light. A branch that grows up from the trunk as opposed to straight out from the trunk is a stronger branch, and casuarina will always put more energy into the upward starting 'stronger' branches.

When the lower branches are about 0.5 cm thick that is the better time to start bending down if that is the style you wish. But primarily, you have kept the upper branches pinched or cut back to encourage the lower branches which will 'take off' because they are reaching up. Then in Spring or Summer, when the lower branches are much thicker and bushier you can bend the branch down and do a hard cut back. However, do not wire or bend down the new growth, keep it growing upwards to promote vigorous upwards growth. For example, on the first branch if you have growth that is angled downwards, then at the end of the branch you have growth shooting upwards, the downwards earlier growth tends to die-back. So, promote the primary branches to grow slightly upwards at first, then when they finally get to 0.5 cm thick (in other words still pliable to be bent strength), then you can angle them down and so on and so on, otherwise it neglects to promote strength in these lower branches. This is the sure guaranteed method of promoting lower dominance in casuarina branches. Keep the upper branches routinely pruned throughout the whole process, and it will always promote strength down below. You will also produce the random gnarled natural look of casuarina branching that you really want, because of this.

You basically apply this same technique throughout the whole structure from the base upwards over time. Remember, always rotate the tree for even sun exposure and if the entire branch area is not in strong sun or shaded continually, it doesn't matter whether you apply the above or not, the whole branch will eventually wilt and may or may not die back completely. I agree with the above mentioned, that it is best to only do heavy cutting back on branches of pencil thickness to lessen complete die back, and also keep in mind, that you do not cut back again on the same area for at LEAST 6 months, otherwise it also encourages die back. So, be confident when you do all the pruning and cutting back initially, DO NOT CHANGE YOUR MIND and prune a bit more or cut a bit more a few weeks or months after the cut because you didn't have the balls to go in hard at first. This promotes weakening and die back from continual cutting on the lower branches. (I presume the tree assumes an animal is gnawing on the foliage and tries to overcome this by shooting high up from the top branches to accelerate growth and avoid death.)

If you already have lower branches that are bent down and showing poor vigour, you can try to promote the ends up which will start the stronger development of the main branch, but I don't use wiring because wiring young growth can promote die back, so I try to use a 'cable tie' piece of plastic (the old school thing they use them on bread bags for a loaf of bread, with a thin wire inside a plastic coating), and tie it once around the stronger branch then just create the remainder into a 'U' and have this pushing the growth up, so it isn't encircling the new growth at all, and is simply pushing it up.

You do not need to worry about pinching on lower branches to encourage bushy growth, because you are still developing branch thickness. You can pinch up top to your hearts content, but also you need to encourage growth with casuarina between pruning, because if you prune/pinch too often, casuarina has a habit of saying 'piss off', and will die back completely and start new branch growth all over again and all your efforts will be in vain. Make sure they have the sunniest position available. Do not wire young shoots or growth.

I usually try to discourage people from doing complete defoliation on casuarina, as it draws its strength from the sun, and without foliage it loses strength, and without this, no matter how much you have adhered to the above principles, it will only force growth up top to maximise survival. You have to pre-empt the reaction of a tree. It doesn't want to display good growth all over for you, it wants to survive and doesn't know that you are only going to prune a bit here or there, it simply reacts to the environment, remember it doesn't think, its genetic code reacts.

On a side note: Casuarina grows logically and once you confidently interpret this it can assist the development better (in theory of course), unless it has been attacked / eaten / or disease or lack of nutrients / root rot / lack of water. Root rot is probably the worst problem to affect casuarina from over watering, because it will die back the foliage all over and you need to re pot and deal with the root rot before you can start the branching again. Lack of watering will generally give 2 outcomes, being usually death of most horizontal branches and the sole focus on one vertical new leader, or a complete die back and concentration of new growth in about a month. If you have external bugs eating the foliage, it can quickly munch through a vital structure of the branch and die-back the entire branch, so be watchful for this too.

CASP1050730.JPG

all good,
With Casuarina in Training you need to allow them to extend shoots with out pinching and cutting . So you allow the red arrows free run never reducing them until they are say pencil size or bigger so they are capable of not dying back when cut. By allowing red shoots to grow strong they become small branches(orange) and when cut back will shoot again .This way to build all primaries,secondaries and tertiary branching. Then once a set of branching has been built /set in place , ramification of foliage(purple) can be worked on by pinching shoots when very young. Your tree shows much promise,keep at it.

Just also apply the upwards growth on this technique, otherwise it can often still not show strong vigour.

PS: any thoughts on trunk chopping below shoots/ green? I've got a leader I want to reduce but unsure of back budding potential, I think it should be OK yeah?

Trunk chopping below growth can usually be done but comes with potential dangers. If you do this in winter or coming into winter it can potentially die back and produce suckering. The optimum time for a trunk chop is middle to late Spring, when the tree is in strong growth. I would as a rule, not trunk chop below the first shoot regardless, for a number of reasons. Make sure the tree is in good health FIRST. If it is not, nurse the tree to good health before you even think about it. Then, just trunk chop above the first shoot, and it will usually produce a heap of new growth anywhere up to 10cm below the chop, and sometimes a lot from below this point as well. Then, you can just pick and choose what you want, but allow all new growth to develop for a few seasons to promote strength. After 9 months or so, if it hasn't produced new growth low enough for you, you can usually just wait for new growth down low, as casuarina commonly produce low shoots continually over time. Otherwise you can trunk chop again to above the first point of growth after a few years. This is my preferred method (patience in other words). I have cut back below the first shoots a few times on stock, and have had it die back to the base, so just bare this in mind.

In regards to re potting casuarina questions above, they can usually be potted any time of the year provided the overnight temps are above 6 degrees. However, best results will be between Spring and Summer. November is probably the BEST month from my experience for a heavy trunk chop or any type of heavy pruning and or re potting. Soak the roots in water throughout the repot and work the roots.

I have even re potted casuarinas a week before winter and a week into winter with no problems (when overnight temps were still above 6 degrees celcius), but I wouldn't cut back the roots hard or foliage hard as well at this time, just a re pot and moderate cutting back.

You can cut the roots quite hard in Spring or Summer or up to mid Autumn, but probably best not to do massive root work outside these months. But remember if you cut back say 50% of roots, then cut back 50% of foliage, provided the root/foliage ratio is normal to start with.

VERY IMPORTANT:
Remember, Torulosa like to have their roots in good drainage and Torulosa ESPECIALLY, don't like to be sitting in damp conditions. Do not over water Torulosa ever. Make sure the soil is almost dry before re watering. The base will quickly start fungus / rot if it is left in boggy conditions or consistently wet. When you are about to re water them, check the soil CLOSE to the base, not just the edge of the pot. IF THE SOIL THAT IS VERY CLOSE TO THE TRUNK, (LIKE WITHIN A FEW CM FROM THE TRUNK AND AN INCH OR MORE DOWN), IS STILL DAMP, DO NOT RE WATER! The danger is that people often rewater by checking the edge of the pot and see the edge is quite dry, so they rewater. But the close feeder roots to the trunk are sitting in continual dampness, and BAM, the root rot starts. Then a few months or sometimes as slow as 6 months later, the foliage loses its vigour. Then you might see fungus / visual signs right below the fissured bark, and the tree will slowly suffocate and die.

Torulosa sometimes tricks new enthusiasts into rewatering too soon, because as the foliage ages, they see the foliage start to droop a little more over a while, and they misinterpret this as a sign that the tree is thirsty. The foliage naturally droops and yes, will droop a little more as the moisture starts to lessen in the pot as it approaches rewatering time. However, the branches will droop a little more as each season goes by, and this is - depending on the style strived for - a good thing. But don't misinterpret the exaggerated droop as a need to rewater, like you see on other trees which means they need a rewater and droop their foliage from lack of moisture. If proper watering is applied, you can develop really good weeping growth by using this to your advantage by leaving the tree until it properly needs watering. This is something that generally only can be learnt over time.

[Ryceman3]

Hi Rory,
This is not my thread and by no means do I want to hijack Boics', however I do want to reply to your post and offer my profound appreciation for the time you took to reply to some of the discussion points that were brought up. The detail and knowledge you put into your post is an invaluable resource for me going forward, so thanks for taking the time to help a novice hopefully not kill (and indeed progress) his tree! Super grateful!!!
R3

[Rory]

Yes, sorry, I hope Boics doesn't mind me ranting in his thread.

As boics' tree wasn't cut initially in the straight section, I felt it would thus be better being taller to minimize the visual effect of the long straight section, but they often have straight sections in nature so it is cool either way. I probably should have just started a new thread for Casuarina growing, but with all the questions in this thread I was just offering Each to their own

If you trunk chop to create taper in Torulosa, for myself it is often primarily to create the more natural jagged trunks that they develop in the wild, not to create a thick short trunk. You can't get this look by wiring. If you grow them 'long and strong', they will taper naturally and thicken very quickly at the chopped sections regardless, so there isn't anything to be concerned about regarding too thick a trunk down low, as this can always be rectified over time. They are such great stock for this and so many reasons as well.

Shohin or smaller is probably the only one style that is very difficult to attain on this species. Die-back and sun are the inherent problems for Torulosa shohin styling. They just don't lend themselves well to it in my opinion, but those that pull off an actual natural looking tree in shohin with great and healthy branch development - rather than a porcupine or an unhealthy stump - it is a great credit to you.

[Ryceman3]

Yes, sorry, I hope Boics doesn't mind me ranting in his thread.

As boics' tree wasn't cut initially in the straight section, I felt it would thus be better being taller to minimize the visual effect of the long straight section, but they often have straight sections in nature so it is cool either way. I probably should have just started a new thread for Casuarina growing, but with all the questions in this thread I was just offering Each to their own

If you trunk chop to create taper in Torulosa, for myself it is often primarily to create the more natural jagged trunks that they develop in the wild, not to create a thick short trunk. You can't get this look by wiring. If you grow them 'long and strong', they will taper naturally and thicken very quickly at the chopped sections regardless, so there isn't anything to be concerned about regarding too thick a trunk down low, as this can always be rectified over time. They are such great stock for this and so many reasons as well.

Shohin or smaller is probably the only one style that is very difficult to attain on this species. Die-back and sun are the inherent problems for Torulosa shohin styling. They just don't lend themselves well to it in my opinion, but those that pull off an actual natural looking tree in shohin with great and healthy branch development - rather than a porcupine or an unhealthy stump - it is a great credit to you.

Any thread you decide to post in relation to growing Casuarina Rory... I WILL READ!
As for my current Torulosa, I plan to develop it as a Shohin ( ) I made this decision before reading your advice above clearly, we'll see how it pans out!
I like Boics' tree in terms of proportion as it stands, I look forward to watching it progress.

[fossil finder]

Cas torulosa can be highly variable and grows differently in different ecosystems. I measured one growing in moist mountain rainforest on mid- north coast that has a 2500mm trunk circumference at chest height and has great taper. I will see if I can get a picture but unsure due to logging activity closing forest......mmm ....maybe I can obtain some seed. ..?..mmm...seed!!..........

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