AusBonsai

Jhalkhoree wrote:I just received delivery of white 30% shade cloth today. Bought it on EBay. I have used 50-70% block in the past and found it to be too shading. Although the growth on many of my trees were fine, I noticed moss growing on the trunk, branches, the rocks and even the tables. Having spoken to Ray Nesci, he suggested using 30% block. Hopefully this works better and not cook the leaves on my maples.
Jay

Do you mind pm'ing me the link to the 30% shade cloth please.

Figured I'd post here instead of creating a new thread.

I'm planning a square shade structure with 4 columns to be serviced by a retractable shade cloth.
I mostly grow pines and junipers (at the moment) - but I also grow maples, elms, ume, chojubai, hinoki, etc.

I was thinking of having two different shades percentages - 50% and 30%.

A few questions:
1) Does shade cloth grow mold or harbour potential diseases / pests when bunched up (retracted and stored over the autumn - winter - spring)? Should one wash it occasionally? Spray it with lime sulphur in winter?
2) Assuming a north-up square, how should I line up the shade cloth? (see image for context). 30/30/50/50 (as pictured)? 30/50/30/50? 50/50/30/30? I'm thinking 50/50/30/30 as the east side will get the most sun, so that's where I'll grow my pines and junipers, whereas I'll grow the deciduous on the west side.
3) Have any of you noticed whether mosquitos (or other insects) are more prevalent under shade cloth? (my body reacts rather strongly to mosquito bites).
4) Is there any point to covering ground grown plants with shade cloth? (maples, shimpaku, pines, prunus)

Also, I read yesterday that black 30% shade cloth is actually 30%, whereas white 30% shade cloth is more like 20%. Makes sense when you think about it (white being more reflective), but I thought it was interesting to see the stats on it.

I built an 8m x 4m structure with 50% white shadecloth at the start of 2022 so I've had one full summer and a couple winters with it now. I would say good plant husbandry reduces the chance of mould and things like that as I haven't noticed any. Bugs do quite like the moderate microclimate though - and if your area harbours mozzies they would probably be drawn to the increased damp conditions. Mine is over lawn so the hardest things is mowing under the benches.
In hot Perth the most fragile thing I'm growing in the ground are Tridents, and with my improved organic content in the soil they get through better than potted Tridents. Mind you they have trees shading them in the afternoon.

EDIT: that reminds me - wonder where that AndrewF bloke went....

BirchMan wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 12:28 pm I built an 8m x 4m structure with 50% white shadecloth at the start of 2022 so I've had one full summer and a couple winters with it now. I would say good plant husbandry reduces the chance of mould and things like that as I haven't noticed any. Bugs do quite like the moderate microclimate though - and if your area harbours mozzies they would probably be drawn to the increased damp conditions. Mine is over lawn so the hardest things is mowing under the benches.
In hot Perth the most fragile thing I'm growing in the ground are Tridents, and with my improved organic content in the soil they get through better than potted Tridents. Mind you they have trees shading them in the afternoon.

EDIT: that reminds me - wonder where that AndrewF bloke went....

Thank you for your reply.

Do you mind me asking how you built your 8x4 structure? E.g.: What size posts did you use, how deep did you dig, did you go with metal or timber?

I'm umming and ahhing a lot over how to build it. I know what dimensions I want, but the construction part is all new to me.

I have lawn / weeds at the moment, but I'm going to replace it all with crushed and compacted rock I think. + geo fabric to reduce the weeds.

Not at all. I work at an engineering firm so I happened to have a mate that's very good with design and construct -type stuff. I had previously gotten a quote for a handyman to do it.. for $5,500. In the end using my mate's tools, plus a few I bought we got it all done for $1,500. We used H4 square pine uprights x 6, about 3m tall and nearly 1m in the ground concreted in, all levelled and squared nicely. Then thinner pine for the horizontals. Still a bit of flex but no one's hanging off it. I stained it with Intergrain merbau to look kind of like jarrah.
I've thought of covering the ground with a fabric but I feel the lawn gives the plants more humid air in summer. See how much longer I last....

I should point out we didn't do a retractable roof. Would've been nice but too much extra complexity. In winter there's enough light coming through that shimps and olives keep growing.

I'm doing the el-cheapo version of Birchman's. 6mx3m carport frame from super cheap for about $200, 50% shade cloth from Bunnings stitched onto it , basic treated pine frame for a wire mesh door from gumtree for $50. Few well spent days with my dad putting it all together and it's noticably cooler underneath even on winter days

TimS wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 1:27 pm I'm doing the el-cheapo version of Birchman's. 6mx3m carport frame from super cheap for about $200, 50% shade cloth from Bunnings stitched onto it , basic treated pine frame for a wire mesh door from gumtree for $50. Few well spent days with my dad putting it all together and it's noticably cooler underneath even on winter days

How has that held up in the wind? Because i would rather spend money on trees than on an expensive shade structure.

The quote i got was around 5600 as well, so it looks like that's what most people are charging Birchman.

Glad to hear you could get it done cheaper yourself, I might try to DIY as well but I'm very interested in this carport option...

I've got it attached to the fence along the length and it's held up fine to the wind, just not as aesthetically pleasing as a nice wood structure

I’ve never had shade cloth.

A good watering system does more in my opinion.

Daluke wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 5:51 pm I’ve never had shade cloth.

A good watering system does more in my opinion.

For me with Japanese Maples they will stay damp all day, it is the intensity of the sun/ wind that burns the leaves so that's why I'm moving to shade cloth for summer

TimS wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 6:20 pm

Daluke wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 5:51 pm I’ve never had shade cloth.

A good watering system does more in my opinion.

For me with Japanese Maples they will stay damp all day, it is the intensity of the sun/ wind that burns the leaves so that's why I'm moving to shade cloth for summer

Wind is killer. I’ve got benches in a lane way and on windy days I put underneath. Still sun - no problem. Sun and wind - killer. I don’t even think it’s the sun, probably just wind.

Yep, wind is a bugger, I'll be planting low shrub near it as a wind break too

SuperBonSaiyan wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 3:03 pm

TimS wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 1:27 pm I'm doing the el-cheapo version of Birchman's. 6mx3m carport frame from super cheap for about $200, 50% shade cloth from Bunnings stitched onto it , basic treated pine frame for a wire mesh door from gumtree for $50. Few well spent days with my dad putting it all together and it's noticably cooler underneath even on winter days

Glad to hear you could get it done cheaper yourself, I might try to DIY as well but I'm very interested in this carport option...

The major cost you'll have is the shade cloth for sure, no way to escape it unfortunately. I can't recall exactly what it cost me but it was at least double what the carport did to get enough in the right lengths to allow it to be stitched without wasting it. I looked at pre-fab shade houses initially and even they were in the 2-3K plus range.

Like you i'd prefer to sink that 2-3K into a high-quality tree, or multiple good pieces of starter material than into a shade structure, so my dad did some work with CAD and made the plans up. I think we have maybe a couple more days left to go on it, the door frame is built and the door is secured on, need to do a bit of framing on the shade house now to fit it in, then stitch on the rest of the shade mesh and it should be done. The shade mesh won't retract at all, but i primarily need it for summer anyway when the delicate trees will be under it all the time anyway. Outside of summer i will be able to use it for propagation and as an area for aftercare of trees as well.

BirchMan wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 1:13 pm nearly 1m in the ground concreted in

Did you dig the hole with machinery? Or just shovel and hands? Also, how wide was your hole? Any aggregate used?

TimS wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 9:57 pm

SuperBonSaiyan wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 3:03 pm

TimS wrote: ↑August 15th, 2023, 1:27 pm I'm doing the el-cheapo version of Birchman's. 6mx3m carport frame from super cheap for about $200, 50% shade cloth from Bunnings stitched onto it , basic treated pine frame for a wire mesh door from gumtree for $50. Few well spent days with my dad putting it all together and it's noticably cooler underneath even on winter days

Glad to hear you could get it done cheaper yourself, I might try to DIY as well but I'm very interested in this carport option...

The major cost you'll have is the shade cloth for sure, no way to escape it unfortunately. I can't recall exactly what it cost me but it was at least double what the carport did to get enough in the right lengths to allow it to be stitched without wasting it. I looked at pre-fab shade houses initially and even they were in the 2-3K plus range.

Like you i'd prefer to sink that 2-3K into a high-quality tree, or multiple good pieces of starter material than into a shade structure, so my dad did some work with CAD and made the plans up. I think we have maybe a couple more days left to go on it, the door frame is built and the door is secured on, need to do a bit of framing on the shade house now to fit it in, then stitch on the rest of the shade mesh and it should be done. The shade mesh won't retract at all, but i primarily need it for summer anyway when the delicate trees will be under it all the time anyway. Outside of summer i will be able to use it for propagation and as an area for aftercare of trees as well.

I'm ok with paying for the cloth, I've looked up prices and it seems like 3mx50m for around 400-450 is the going rate.

I was planning to build a structure out of black powder coated poles (imagine cricket batting cages), and then run the cloth along wires down the length of it.

I might still try and do this, but the carport will serve for this upcoming summer if I don't get it done in time.