Ficus Naked

Share your success stories about defoliation, bare rooting and anything else relating to maintaining healthy bonsai.
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Ficus Naked

Post by Pup »

In a post on this site which I cant find now. Anttal 63 suggested defoliating Figs 3 times in one season. He was doubted. I said I agree so and said I would post pics of mine which were done 3 weeks ago. The first pic is a boabab style it was the first Bonsai!!! we ever owned. 1980 a raffle prize did not look like this.
It survived 5 years of neglect till I started Bonsai. By that time it had formed its pot belly so it stayed. The others are also early trees the one with the turn buckles is undergoing a re style from aerial roots which I grafted at soil level. The one on the stone is self sown it is now breaking the rock.
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by PeterW »

Pup wrote:In a post on this site which I cant find now. Anttal 63 suggested defoliating Figs 3 times in one season. He was doubted. I said I agree so and said I would post pics of mine which were done 3 weeks ago. The first pic is a boabab style it was the first Bonsai!!! we ever owned. 1980 a raffle prize did not look like this.
It survived 5 years of neglect till I started Bonsai. By that time it had formed its pot belly so it stayed. The others are also early trees the one with the turn buckles is undergoing a re style from aerial roots which I grafted at soil level. The one on the stone is self sown it is now breaking the rock.
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Hi Pup
Do you have the book "Ficus Bonsai" by Hoy Leong Kwong? Defoliation shouldnt be done until after the temperature at night has reached a constant 18% and above. This is usually around Late August/September in my area. (others should relate this to their climate). That is the first defoliation.(dont wire or bend branches at this time) The new leaves should appear after about 6 weeks. Branches and branchlets should be allowed to grow untouched untill Early November. 2nd Defoliation should be done Early to mid December and the tips should also be pruned. Defoliation shouldn't be done after the end of February as the leaves that develop will have long internodes and will also be larger in size. By this time, if the tree was healthy during this process, it should be looking very good and have a nice crop of small leaves and some good ramification.
This is from the abovementioned book and i have grown some small figs with this method for 2 years and have had some encouraging results. My Green Island Figs have leaves smaller then an average pinkie's fingernail. I have a Port Jackson fig that also has a very small leaf size as well. Celtis is another plant that responds well to these same processes at the same timings. It has been quite warm here already this year so i defoliated for the second time already with two of my little figs late last week.
If you havent read this book and you want to grow Figs, you should find it and read it, the author really does know his stuff, especially figs!
Peter.
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Pup »

Thank you for response Peter. I have as I said the trees ages are from 1985 so.I have been growing them for some time. I also have glanced though Leong's book I also own Jerry Meislik book Ficus the exotic Bonsai.
As I have said in the past and will no doubt say again, reading it in a book is fine, proving it yourself is better. Regards Pup
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Steven »

Lovely tree's Pup - as always! Excellent taper and movement.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts behind the development of these tree's Pup. They are not your typical Ficus. I'd be equally as interested to hear your thoughts on the timing of defoliation.

PeterW, thanks for pointing out Leong's advice and timing for defoliation. However we need to be careful when following anyones advice on performing a technique in a particular 'month' of the year. Climate changes from Suburb to suburb let along State to State. Also it's almost December and currently only 11 degrees C here in Sydney.

Regards,
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Pup »

Steven you have said it. In the northern suburbs of Perth there temps have been higher than mine. I do how ever share the notion of night temps. I do not think 18 I go with 15 but soil temp plays a part also if that is low the tree wont move as well.
What I find is if you plce them in a cold frame type out house. In your state west facing wall fence which generates some warmth during the day.
I find Ficus to be hungry so plenty of ferts.
BUT not high in Nitrogen unless you are pushing the tree as it will give you big leaves. Twisting the sheath as it forms will give small leaves.
As does Dot Koreshoffs method of cut a leaf.
Steven as with my post to Jon to get some. if you use the method of not letting the branches get to heavy. Other wise you have to cut them back. To start over. If you are starting one of then do not be concerned with leaf reduction as in Pines. Get the tree styled then shaped then start the refinement. Taper is some thing you have to keep in mind all the time do not let the High branches get to heavy.
Also if you have aireal roots they will make the branches bigger. If they are on the trunk you can use them to graft roots at soil level. I hope this goes some way to help. As always :lol: Pup
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by PeterW »

AusBonsai wrote:Lovely tree's Pup - as always! Excellent taper and movement.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts behind the development of these tree's Pup. They are not your typical Ficus. I'd be equally as interested to hear your thoughts on the timing of defoliation.

PeterW, thanks for pointing out Leong's advice and timing for defoliation. However we need to be careful when following anyones advice on performing a technique in a particular 'month' of the year. Climate changes from Suburb to suburb let along State to State. Also it's almost December and currently only 11 degrees C here in Sydney.

Regards,
Steven
Hello Steven,
Yes of course we all must watch and be guided by our own climate, thats why i pointed it out in my post. The calender is the most obvious guideline as we know (roughly) what weather is comming next.

Hello Pup,
Please dont take this personally Pup, but if those trees posted have been in training for over 20 years, you really should take a much longer look at Leongs book. Some of the trees in that book have had much less time in training and are a much higher quality. You be the judge.
Kind Regards,
Peter
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Pup »

PeterW wrote:
AusBonsai wrote:Lovely tree's Pup - as always! Excellent taper and movement.
I'd be interested to hear your thoughts behind the development of these tree's Pup. They are not your typical Ficus. I'd be equally as interested to hear your thoughts on the timing of defoliation.

PeterW, thanks for pointing out Leong's advice and timing for defoliation. However we need to be careful when following anyones advice on performing a technique in a particular 'month' of the year. Climate changes from Suburb to suburb let along State to State. Also it's almost December and currently only 11 degrees C here in Sydney.

Regards,
Steven
Hello Steven,
Yes of course we all must watch and be guided by our own climate, thats why i pointed it out in my post. The calender is the most obvious guideline as we know (roughly) what weather is comming next.
Hello Pup,
Please dont take this personally Pup, but if those trees posted have been in training for over 20 years, you really should take a much longer look at Leongs book. Some of the trees in that book have had much less time in training and are a much higher quality. You be the judge.
Kind Regards,
Peter
How should I take it.
I do have other trees. Also a lot of my FIGS if you READ my post are undergoing drastic re styles.
By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and Books.
Last edited by Pup on November 24th, 2008, 8:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by PeterW »

How should I take it.
I do have other trees. Also a lot of my FIGS if you READ my post are undergoing drastic re styles.
By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and Books.[/quote]


Not personally Pup as i stated.
Lets keep our eyes on the ball Pup. This was a discussion regarding defoliation, not weather yours is bigger then mine!
I do respect you ability as a bonsai grower Pup, but however those trees are not up to your usual standard, in my opinion. They dont do you justice.
I dont understand the intent behind your statement regarding "By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and books" and i am not really all that interested in it either!
I do apologies if i have upset you, it wasnt intended.
Regards,
Peter
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Jon Chown »

Do you have the book "Ficus Bonsai" by Hoy Leong Kwong? Defoliation shouldnt be done until after the temperature at night has reached a constant 18% and above. This is usually around Late August/September in my area. (others should relate this to their climate). That is the first defoliation.(dont wire or bend branches at this time) The new leaves should appear after about 6 weeks. Branches and branchlets should be allowed to grow untouched untill Early November. 2nd Defoliation should be done Early to mid December and the tips should also be pruned. Defoliation shouldn't be done after the end of February as the leaves that develop will have long internodes and will also be larger in size. By this time, if the tree was healthy during this process, it should be looking very good and have a nice crop of small leaves and some good ramification.
This is from the abovementioned book and i have grown some small figs with this method for 2 years and have had some encouraging results. My Green Island Figs have leaves smaller then an average pinkie's fingernail. I have a Port Jackson fig that also has a very small leaf size as well. Celtis is another plant that responds well to these same processes at the same timings. It has been quite warm here already this year so i defoliated for the second time already with two of my little figs late last week.
If you havent read this book and you want to grow Figs, you should find it and read it, the author really does know his stuff, especially figs!
Peter.
Great post Peter - this one should go in the Library Steven. This is exactly what AusBonsai is all about.

Jon
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Pup »

PeterW wrote:How should I take it.
I do have other trees. Also a lot of my FIGS if you READ my post are undergoing drastic re styles.
By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and Books.

Not personally Pup as i stated.
Lets keep our eyes on the ball Pup. This was a discussion regarding defoliation, not weather yours is bigger then mine!
I do respect you ability as a bonsai grower Pup, but however those trees are not up to your usual standard, in my opinion. They dont do you justice.
I dont understand the intent behind your statement regarding "By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and books" and i am not really all that interested in it either!
I do apologies if i have upset you, it wasnt intended.
Regards,
Peter[/quote] Peter you picked up Steven by saying if you read my Post. As stated in mine my trees are under going restyles the fig with the guy wires was started last November.
The others in March, the branch that was part of the fig with the turn buckles is a struck cutting from November. What I am saying is my trees get posted when I am doing some thing or not. Not just when they are at there best. As for mine being bigger . I did not say any thing about your trees Good bad or other wise I was doing what you claim you were. My eye is certainly on the Ball . I will get this fantastic book from the Library tonight at the club. Seeing as I don't have it in mine. When discussion is the subject critiques aren't necessary unless asked for you made a statement that two members here disagreed with. :)
. Pup
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by PeterW »

Pup wrote:
PeterW wrote:How should I take it.
I do have other trees. Also a lot of my FIGS if you READ my post are undergoing drastic re styles.
By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and Books.

Not personally Pup as i stated.
Lets keep our eyes on the ball Pup. This was a discussion regarding defoliation, not weather yours is bigger then mine!
I do respect you ability as a bonsai grower Pup, but however those trees are not up to your usual standard, in my opinion. They dont do you justice.
I dont understand the intent behind your statement regarding "By the way all the trees I post are mine. Even the ones in International Magazines and books" and i am not really all that interested in it either!
I do apologies if i have upset you, it wasnt intended.
Regards,
Peter
Peter you picked up Steven by saying if you read my Post. (False) As stated in mine my trees are under going restyles the fig with the guy wires was started last November. (Actually all you said about this tree was "The others are also early trees the one with the turn buckles is undergoing a re style.....")[/i]
The others in March, the branch that was part of the fig with the turn buckles is a struck cutting from November. What I am saying is my trees get posted when I am doing some thing or not. Not just when they are at there best. As for mine being bigger . I did not say any thing about your trees Good bad or other wise I was doing what you claim you were. My eye is certainly on the Ball . I will get this fantastic book from the Library tonight at the club. Seeing as I don't have it in mine. When discussion is the subject critiques aren't necessary unless asked for you made a statement that two members here disagreed with. :)
. Pup[/quote]


What a mix mash you have there Pup!
Firstly it was your quote that you are stating that i made!
I didnt correct Steven at all, i simply concured with him as i stated in my post.
As far as critiques on your trees, i didnt give a critique on them, i said "if those trees posted have been in training for over 20 years....." There was no critique and i woulndt be that rude to do so.
The post was posted in a section were we should all be sharing our expirience and knowledge for the betterment of all. I simply added to it.
As i keep saying Pup, there is absolutely nothing personal in this, i simply believe that there is a better proven benchmark with regards to the training and growing of ficus bonsai then that what was originally mentioned. Nothing more, nothing less. have a nice evening Pup, go out and play with your trees, they are truly lovely.
Regards
Peter
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by PeterW »

Great post Peter - this one should go in the Library Steven. This is exactly what AusBonsai is all about.

Jon[/quote]

Thanks Jon, but i dont deserve any credit for this, the credit belongs squarly with Leong. Its his expierience and information that i am simply using from his book. I have no doubt that my few figs wouldnt be where they are today without this book.
Regards
Peter
Ps...what side of Brissie are you on? We have a monthly get together if your interested, on the North side.
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Jon Chown »

Hi Peter, While you may not deserve the credit for the information, you deserve the credit for the information about where to obtain the information. And that my friend is what I recon AusBonsai is all about.

Leong's book is now on my Christmas list.

Peter, I do believe that we have met before at the Bimer club show. I am a friend of Tony Bebb and Karen Gibbs and a lot of other members of the club. Saturdays at Chermside unfortunately does not fit in with my Real Estate Open House times. I am also a Southsider.

Jon
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by PeterW »

Jon Chown wrote:Hi Peter, While you may not deserve the credit for the information, you deserve the credit for the information about where to obtain the information. And that my friend is what I recon AusBonsai is all about.

Leong's book is now on my Christmas list.

Peter, I do believe that we have met before at the Bimer club show. I am a friend of Tony Bebb and Karen Gibbs and a lot of other members of the club. Saturdays at Chermside unfortunately does not fit in with my Real Estate Open House times. I am also a Southsider.

Jon
Sorry to take so long to respond to this Jon. I read the post a few days ago and went on with other things and forgot!
I thought that you did look familiar but i couldnt put a place with the face. I struggle to get to meetings also, always seems as though there is something more pressing that i have to do. Busy life hey! What nurseries do you visit? I dont get over to the southside very often, but when i do i always drop into Steve's or when i go to the Gold Coast i drop into Chris's place. They are both pretty good nurseries. I got a nice big Trident stump from Chris last Christmas. Hope you enjoy Leongs book, you will find your figs will benifit from it i am sure.
Regards
Peter.
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Re: Ficus Naked

Post by Jon Chown »

Hi Peter, I started my training with Lindsay Bebb in 1984 when he was at Moorooka then followed him to Coopers Plains until he sold the nursery and moved to the Redlands - I have not visited him since and not sure if he is still dealing with the public. I have bought many trees from Steve Rawkins at Australian Bonsai Grower and I did a Black Pine course with them. I guess I have visited most nurseries in Brisbane and the Gold Coast at one time or other.

Next time you are down in the Big smoke we should catch up for a coffee and chat - give me a call as I work from home and can always find time for a Bonsai Buddy.

Jon
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