Stock.

[Asus101]

So here is a little discussion on stock.

What do you look at when buying stock?

Do you know what good stock is and how to find it?

Would you buy a "completed" tree and restyle it?

When collecting do you collect for the sake of collecting or do you choose stock based on the trunk (the branching being easier to grow back)?

[Hector Johnson]

What do I loook at?

Price, first of all. Is it within the price range I'm prepared to pay?
Species. Is it a species I want to work with? How much maintenance do I anticipate it will require?
Base. What do I see in the base and surface roots? Is it going to make a good picture when cleaned up and potted?
Trunk line. Is the trunk likely to present a problem when styling the branches and foliage? Are there any obvious faults in it?
Taper. Is there a plausible taper in the trunk and major branches?
Branching options. How many branches do I see on the trunk? Are there enough and are they radially dispersed on the trunk?
Health of the tree? Any apparent infestations of bugs? Any sign of underfeeding or dependence upon shade? Are lower branches vigorous and well-nourished.

Good stock is described above.
You find it at a specialist bonsai grower or once in 5000 at your local garden nursery.

Why would you restyle a completed tree? Buy the thing and appreciate it. Maintain it at its current standard for as long as you can or make a change or two to correct any fault you might find. If it's truly completed then there should be no faults... every bonsai has some faults to every critical viewer, in my opinion.

Collecting for the sake of collecting? Is that like buying shoes for the sake of buying shoes? The question doesn't really compute.
You only collect what you need, based on what you are capable of working with, as far as I am concerned. If a species doesn't shoot back on old wood then it's not suitable for bonsai. Leave it there.

[Asus101]

Collecting for the sake of collecting, as in collecting a tree with nice barking or movement and cutting back to a complete stump and re growing?

[Hector Johnson]

Collecting for the sake of collecting, as in collecting a tree with nice barking or movement and cutting back to a complete stump and re growing?

If there's a flaw in the trunk then you wouldn't collect it unless you had a plan to correct it.
If it's got something going for it then it may be worth collecting. If not then it stays where it is.
If it's got nice movement in the trunk but no branches then it's just a nice trunk. If it is a species that will shoot back as a result of a top chop then perhaps you can take your chances on it doing something worthwhile.

[MelaQuin]

I seldom go out looking for a specific tree but try to find something that has a feature that takes my fancy and then, presuming there is more than one of the species, look for the one that has the most potential and character. Shooting back on old wood is important as a number of great trunks have been left behind because the foliage is too far out and I know I won't be able to get it back. I've picked up really, really ratz Melaleuca Revolution Gold's because I love the colour of the foliage and the bark and I know this tree shoots back well so what it doesn't have I have a good chance of getting in a year or so.

I try to be economical so price is important. I made three offers on a tree and got it at the too high offer but this I don't regret. Although the tree was a bonsai, tho a bit out of control, I really restyled it and within 6 months could definitely say it was 'my tree - the work of my hand [and god's]. I cannot see buying a styled bonsai and going along with it as purchased.... I would want to do changes to make it my tree.

If I am collecting yamidori the tree has to be special to make the effort worthwhile. But part of that has to do with the physical disabilities of age and hoarding energy. I'd rather buy what someone else has collected - safer on my joints, tho far less fun.

[Hector Johnson]

True words indeed, [MelaQuin]. Have you ever noticed how the day you choose to dig up a tree for bonsai turns out to be the hottest, most humid day of the year and coincides with the onset of the fly plague and also happens to be your unluckiest day of the year too (The one when you trip three times, stand on a rake and squash all seven of your thumbs between shovel and large rocks)? I hate that about collecting trees. I'd rather pay someone else to do it.

[anttal63]

hec im tuning up the violin

[Asus101]

I'd rather pay someone else to do it.

You want olives? Or Hawthorns?

[Hector Johnson]

I wouldn't mind some olive stock. They don't grow wild around here. I have one that I've just laid down into a raft style. I've been wondering how to style it for three years.

Send me photos and we'll talk price. I have just got off crutches after 7 weeks, since breaking my ankle, so I won't be wielding a shovel anytime soon.

[Asus101]

Ill be doing a lot of collecting this winter. if they are budded by autumn next year they should be okk to move.

You want nebari focus or tuber focus?

[Dave54]

[quote="Hector Johnson"]What do I loook at?

"Why would you restyle a completed tree? Buy the thing and appreciate it. Maintain it at its current standard for as long as you can or make a change or two to correct any fault you might find. If it's truly completed then there should be no faults... every bonsai has some faults to every critical viewer, in my opinion."



Hi Hector, I really can't for one moment think that you really believe this !
When ever is a tree really FINISHED. I know that with my trees, they evolve yearly, maybe shortened, maybe a branch removed, possibly turning a "cascade" into an "informal Upright".

Surely you don't think that everyone in bonsai has extracted the absolute potential from their trees. Don't you attend shows and whilst looking at a tree, say to yourself "If that was mine, I would.........."

How boring to buy or for that matter own a tree that doesn't evolve with time.
cheers
Dave

[Dave54]

Hi ASUS

I've probably upset Hector, however, I often buy trees from other people's collections, generally because I find that you can obtain a true bargain when collectors are downsizing.
Treat the purchase of "Completed" bonsai as Pre-trained stock, and with luck, it may have saved you a quick 20 years or so.
You naturally only purchase material that you feel has some potential. If you think you can improve the tree, buy it. I know a lot of enthusiasts don't have much artistic or designing flare, so if that is the case maybe you do have to purchase a "Finished" tree and leave it as it is.
When purchasing raw material, know your stock. Be aware of trees that shoot back on bare wood e.g privet. Olive, Elm. Fig etc. so if in the market for these, you really only have to look for a nice nebari, nice trunk movement and nice trunk movement. Any enthusiast should be able to grow branches from new shoots so it is the abovementioned things to look for.
Having said that, The absolute must about any "quality" tree is CHARACTER. If it doesn't have CHARACTER....leave it there!!!
cheers
Dave

[Leigh Taafe]

Good comments Dave.

Your Boug in the other post is testament to this. Good on you!

Cheers,
Leigh.

[Asus101]

I too agree with dave.
There is nothing more exciting than seeing a former cascade juniper turned into a formal upright.