Layer of Drainage advice

Share your ideas on re-potting, potting mediums and fertilisers.
Post Reply
annaf
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 4:00 pm
Favorite Species: Jade
Bonsai Age: 1
Location: Melbourne

Layer of Drainage advice

Post by annaf »

I am new to the group and to Bonsai,

Can I ask what ppl use on the bottom of there bonsai pots, I am in Melbourne and am getting very confused on what to use, do you use such as lava rock, scoria, gravel, grit, and where to buy it. I went to a local Mulch supply and the gravel I purchased seemed ok but when I rinsed it, it was full of cloudy water. Would appreciate any advice, I am new to bonsai, I have a few Jade, Junipers.

Very much enjoying the forum :)
shibui
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7653
Joined: August 22nd, 2009, 8:41 pm
Favorite Species: trident maple
Bonsai Age: 41
Bonsai Club: Albury/Wodonga; BSV; Canberra; VNBC
Location: Yackandandah
Has thanked: 65 times
Been thanked: 1399 times
Contact:

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by shibui »

You will find that there are many experts in bonsai and all have slightly different ways of doing the same thing. That does not mean some are wrong, it just means that plants can survive all sorts of abuse.
There are 2 schools of thought on drainage layer. Some growers still use the traditional method of a coarser grade of their chosen potting mix at the bottom of the pot. Most, including me, don't use any drainage layer. There is evidence that a drainage layer actually impedes drainage and can result in waterlogged root zone.
My advice: Just start with your chosen potting mix (still use mesh over the holes so it won't all fall through) place the tree in position and top up with more of the same potting mix. Works for me.
http://shibuibonsai.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Daluke
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 1022
Joined: September 15th, 2014, 8:04 pm
Favorite Species: Juniper
Bonsai Age: 8
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 17 times
Been thanked: 105 times

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by Daluke »

Anything coarse which doesn’t break down is good.

Gravel, grit, lava, scoria, pumice, pebbles, broken glass, crushed brick... use your imagination anything that when compacted has some gaps in between works.

The drainage layer though does not in fact help drainage. It helps oxygen get to the roots and “breath”.

In turn this helps promote growth.
annaf
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 4:00 pm
Favorite Species: Jade
Bonsai Age: 1
Location: Melbourne

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by annaf »

Daluke wrote:Anything coarse which doesn’t break down is good.

Gravel, grit, lava, scoria, pumice, pebbles, broken glass, crushed brick... use your imagination anything that when compacted has some gaps in between works.

The drainage layer though does not in fact help drainage. It helps oxygen get to the roots and “breath”.

In turn this helps promote growth.
Thanks for your advice, l have heard it’s more for the roots to breath than drainage.
annaf
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 4:00 pm
Favorite Species: Jade
Bonsai Age: 1
Location: Melbourne

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by annaf »

shibui wrote:You will find that there are many experts in bonsai and all have slightly different ways of doing the same thing. That does not mean some are wrong, it just means that plants can survive all sorts of abuse.
There are 2 schools of thought on drainage layer. Some growers still use the traditional method of a coarser grade of their chosen potting mix at the bottom of the pot. Most, including me, don't use any drainage layer. There is evidence that a drainage layer actually impedes drainage and can result in waterlogged root zone.
My advice: Just start with your chosen potting mix (still use mesh over the holes so it won't all fall through) place the tree in position and top up with more of the same potting mix. Works for me.
Thanks you for replying, it’s good to hear what ppl are doing, l guess it comes down to what works for you,
annaf
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 4:00 pm
Favorite Species: Jade
Bonsai Age: 1
Location: Melbourne

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by annaf »

shibui wrote:You will find that there are many experts in bonsai and all have slightly different ways of doing the same thing. That does not mean some are wrong, it just means that plants can survive all sorts of abuse.
There are 2 schools of thought on drainage layer. Some growers still use the traditional method of a coarser grade of their chosen potting mix at the bottom of the pot. Most, including me, don't use any drainage layer. There is evidence that a drainage layer actually impedes drainage and can result in waterlogged root zone.
My advice: Just start with your chosen potting mix (still use mesh over the holes so it won't all fall through) place the tree in position and top up with more of the same potting mix. Works for me.
Thanks you for replying, it’s good to hear what ppl are doing, l guess it comes down to what works for you,
User avatar
MJL
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 2840
Joined: October 26th, 2014, 8:47 pm
Favorite Species: Maples, Elms, Cedars and Pines
Bonsai Age: 7
Bonsai Club: Waverley Bonsai Group & Yarra Valley Bonsai Society
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 424 times
Been thanked: 643 times

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by MJL »

I am no expert but a drainage layer at all times for me.

I've always put drainage layers into my normal potted plants and now I have transferred this habit into bonsai. I generally use stones with a size matched to the pot I am using at any given time. I get a sense of comfort from seeing water drip from my drainage holes ... (on my bonsai people!! :palm:) ....

I also find it easier to repot bonsai with drainage stones because I find that I can tease out and then trim the base roots easier when I do repot.

Each to their own.
Tending bonsai teaches me patience.
User avatar
treeman
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 2836
Joined: August 15th, 2011, 4:47 pm
Favorite Species: any
Bonsai Age: 25
Location: melbourne
Has thanked: 28 times
Been thanked: 571 times

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by treeman »

Mike
User avatar
MJL
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 2840
Joined: October 26th, 2014, 8:47 pm
Favorite Species: Maples, Elms, Cedars and Pines
Bonsai Age: 7
Bonsai Club: Waverley Bonsai Group & Yarra Valley Bonsai Society
Location: Melbourne
Has thanked: 424 times
Been thanked: 643 times

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by MJL »

treeman wrote:I touched on this subject here..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=24510&hilit=+drain ... tion+layer

Thanks - that's a very good thread that Treeman points us to. I now understand the concept of an aeration layer, at least at a superficial laymnn level. I also understand the concept of drainage manipulation as noted by Bretts in the tother thread. Good stuff - thanks for passing on the knowledge.
Tending bonsai teaches me patience.
annaf
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 4:00 pm
Favorite Species: Jade
Bonsai Age: 1
Location: Melbourne

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by annaf »

treeman wrote:I touched on this subject here..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=24510&hilit=+drain ... tion+layer
I had ready that article, interesting read, thank
annaf
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 7
Joined: July 30th, 2018, 4:00 pm
Favorite Species: Jade
Bonsai Age: 1
Location: Melbourne

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by annaf »

MJL wrote:I am no expert but a drainage layer at all times for me.

I've always put drainage layers into my normal potted plants and now I have transferred this habit into bonsai. I generally use stones with a size matched to the pot I am using at any given time. I get a sense of comfort from seeing water drip from my drainage holes ... (on my bonsai people!! :palm:) ....

I also find it easier to repot bonsai with drainage stones because I find that I can tease out and then trim the base roots easier when I do repot.

Each to their own.
Thanks for your feedback,
Dean
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 24
Joined: September 7th, 2017, 8:48 pm
Favorite Species: Maple
Bonsai Age: 35
Bonsai Club: Urimbirra
Location: Robertson, NSW
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by Dean »

I only use a drainage layer in cascade pots because my normal mix is very free draining.

Sent from my Agora 4G+ using Tapatalk
Shagga
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Aussie Bonsai Fan
Posts: 31
Joined: June 17th, 2017, 10:19 am
Favorite Species: Any
Bonsai Age: 1
Bonsai Club: None
Location: Box Hill, Vic.

Re: Layer of Drainage advice

Post by Shagga »

Hey everyone

The way I see it and I ain’t no expert is that when you flood the soil as it drains through to the bottom it sucks fresh air down from from above. Once this process is done the roots suck the moisture from the soil and having a drainage layer makes it possible for air to come from above as well as up through the drainage holes.
This is just my assumption...
In saying this I’ve used drainage layers when I had something to use and if not mix straight in on top of the screens and I can’t tell you for sure based on my experience if it makes any difference but I think it makes sense I guess. :lost:

Chris
:aussie:
Post Reply

Return to “Repotting, Soil and Fertilisers”