AusBonsai

Today I was mucking around with a picture I posted recently of a River Red Gum, removing branches and changing angles.

As I’ve stated before even though I really like this tree it was initially styled like a traditional Bonsai rather than like an actual gum tree.

So here is an attempt to make it look more natural, or Australian, or whatever you want to call it. What do people think? Does it look more like a gum tree? Is it an improvement? Have your say!


Cheers,
Matt.

Hi Matt, I like the look of your virt - the less "full" look strikes me as much more natural

My initial thought when seeing the tree was to lower the apex and shorten the RHS a little as it seems like the tree wants to move to the left. I don't think it makes it look any more like a eucalyptus though. Lovely tree whatever you decide to do

I like Josh's virt better than yours Matt. But to my eye even in Josh's virt it has too much ramification and still looks like a traditional bonsai style

Hi Matt ,
I think the twists and turns of the trunk and major branches are on the money. Instead of cutting back major growth how about thinning out some of the ramification. Let a few select smaller branches get a little length and generally open up the tree. Less is more....
Cheers John.

boom64 wrote: ↑February 11th, 2020, 7:53 pm Hi Matt ,
I think the twists and turns of the trunk and major branches are on the money. Instead of cutting back major growth how about thinning out some of the ramification. Let a few select smaller branches get a little length and generally open up the tree. Less is more....
Cheers John.

Matt, I agree with this , a lot of the Eucs I see have most of the foliage out from the trunk on longer branches.

Hey Matt,

I am on the Squatjar Boom train too. I think go with the movement of the tree - I think this tree wants to lean out over a river or dry creek. Apologies for the dirty, quick virt but something like this ... and over time less on the right, more on the left with one or two branches near touching the 'water'.

I think I will be swimming against the tide here but.........
I prefer the original. The greater the ramification generally the smaller the leaves and with small leaves it gives a better overall impression. In our area I see many Euc's with movement in the trunk and the trees themselves are quite full foliage wise.
I have dug a few Euc's just because they had some movement (they weren't telegraph poles) and this appeals to me because as they get older they do appear to straighten.
A different view for what its worth.

Thanks for all the thoughtful replies. There's a few different opinions which is what I wanted.

There's a couple of common ideas I'd like to tease out:

- Some people (including myself) like Squarjar's virt, although we all seem to agree that it makes for a better traditional bonsai shape and not necessarily more like a Euc.

- Similar ideas for a more slanting style and once again I think this lends itself to a classic asymmetrical triangle.

- Lots of comments referring to the sparseness and distribution of the foliage.

Here's what I think - It's hard to pin down what makes a Gum tree look like a Gum tree especially with so much variation even within the same species but I have a few ideas regarding the River Red Gum. Foliage and shapes can be broken down into different types:

- Sparse foliage mainly at the tips creating soft hemispheres, looking like a parachute. Overall shape is of an inverted triangle.

- Low, spreading branches with heavy hanging foliage

- Heavy trunks with crazy branching and unusual shapes

Some features are common:
- Primary branches start at a shallow angle and are often a similar thickness to the main trunk
- Lots of jins within the branches, particularly on the underside of branches
- Surface nebari isn't a major feature, although there are some notable exceptions.
- Not a classic triangle.

Taking all this into account I may never get this tree to look like a real River Red Gum, although the something like the first picture above may be achievable. I'll probably keep it going as is and use other material to try and replicate what I think a tree in the wild looks like.

More comments are welcome!

Cheers,
Matt.

The first picture with the rainbow is great inspiration to follow. Maybe your tree is not that far from natural euc after all. I like the ramification too and wouldn't thin it out. There's plenty of sparse eucs out there. Yours has ramification many would like to have

Hey Matt,

I’m having my say….You’ve presented your tree here defoliated which I know emphasises the trunk line, ramification of the branch structure, & blah, blah, blah,.. but for me it’s still a slightly misleading image to judge. Being an evergreen it would never really display this amount of full on nudity! (unless dead perhaps?)

If possible, could you re-photo & post back up when the leaves re-shoot. It’s difficult to advise fairly on style, as a whole, with all of the characteristic foliage missing?

I’m with Watto, with the amount of ramification you have & masses of small gum leaves, I can imagine this tree might look quite stunning and truer to it’s natural form, but the momentary deciduous look is…umm?..well it’s just not cricket!

My say is now over.

Limitless design possibilities that may not follow classic bonsai forms/styles. Of the photos posted - I am attracted to the ones where the top is sparse or has been ripped out/broken or is just weaker. I cannot explain why ... there’s something deep-seated - in my skull - which is attracted to gums with hanging side branches, heavier foliage to a side or even in both sides. No’s 6, 3 wonderful and the Jin’s in the centre of number 4.

Somehow these trees and our care for them is about attitude and embracing rapid, random change... with some species of tree you clip and you have a reasonable sense of where the next branches may grow. Not with these bad boys ... you clip/break and pow bloody anything happens. Perhaps this may frustrate some ... but I reckon the attitude is to embrace the random nature of the outcome. What the heck am I getting at ?? I guess all bonsai change direction through the course of the people caring for them - but many trees take time to alter form and shape ... and we kid ourselves that we have a semblance of control. River gums seem to completely change form/style/shape - quite rapidly based on random responses to decision we make. This is exciting but may require a change in mindset ...

Perhaps Matt, you aim for style - and indeed, you achieve that style but maybe only for a season or two - and then bang, the thing sprouts a branch we didn’t even think or a branch does and only a season or two later we have a completely different style of tree. Our slanting style, turns informal upright, turns into something we never imagined but is magnificent in its wild chaos.

Sorry Matt ... long day at work ... just a stream of consciousness...a ramble that highlights the chaos in my own mind.


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Matt S wrote: ↑February 12th, 2020, 9:29 am
red gum 5.jpg

red gum 3.jpg
red gum 6.JPG

Those last 3 pictures you posted are so beautiful. I'd love to have a Euc that looked like any of those last 3.

Eucalyptus branching is sometimes very unique compared to other genus. It really depends on the Eucalyptus species and where its growing.

There are many with long wavy branches and foliage sparsely growing on the ends.
There are some that twist a lot and are ramified well.
There are those with multi-trunks at the base and flare out well.

All in all though, if you're after an immediately iconic Euc you should take a pic of your tree and hold it up to the background of real Eucs and ask yourself 'does that look like a tree that you'd see?' Sometimes it helps to actually compare the tree you are wanting to emulate right next to yours and be your own critic.

Looking good . It’s a bit tall but so are a lot of gums . The hardest thing I find with a lot of gums is to reduce leaves and ramify well . You are doing both ,it gives me hope .

KCaR .theres another thread here .https://www.ausbonsai.com.au/forum/view ... 86#p267417

Here's another design just to mix it up for you. While it is a great little tree, for me I think what looks most out of place is how juvenile the trunk looks. Not sure if you have a low branch you can use as a sacrifice to thicken the lower half of the trunk in order to induce some taper? The black branches on mine are deadwood. Goodluck with whatever route you take.

Cheers,
Pearcy.