Does anyone know what these little wire pots are?

[CommonCalluna]

Hello friends,

It was pay day yesterday, so naturally today I found myself at the big green shed. I told myself it was only for irrigation supplies and a bag of perlite, but, well, we all know how it goes.

I ended up with 6 little seedlings of species I'm interested in. They were all growing roots out the bottom of their seedling pots, and today's a lovely wet day for repotting, so I gently moved them from their tiny pots to a 10cm grow pot for the summer.

On two of the trees/sticks there are these very fine meshed pot type things surrounding the original root ball. The rest just had a build up of peat, which is what I assume they propogated them in. For the Cotoneaster and melaleuca thymifolia however there are these tiny pot type things completely surrounding the inner football of the plant. The texture I can best compare it to is fishing line. Like someone crocheted a plant pot out of fishing line.






I know we've got some nursery growers, and professional growers here, I was wondering if anyone might know what these are. And most importantly are they biodegradable like the peat/cardboard pots sometimes used for starters, or do I need to try and figure out how to remove these from the roots without killing the plant somehow?

They were cheap seedlings. I bought them mostly out of curiosity for developing my own starter trees and getting the hang of techniques on trees I'm less invested in than my older ones ( I'm definitely challenged in the ability to 'not f*** with it, like many beginners ) but I'd still like to keep them alive and grow them into bonsai if I can.

Any knowledge, wisdom, advice, or help welcomed

[Daluke]

Looks like rock wool.

[Grant Bowie]

Yes, they would be a striking pot or material and Rockwool would be a good candidate.

[CommonCalluna]

Thankyou for your help.
It's very thin whatever it is. It's like a net around the media rather than the growing media itself.
Can I leave it on, buried like I found it?
Or do I have to figure out how to untangle the roots from the net and cut it off?

Chopstick for an attempt at scale.



post a pic

[TimS]

ahh yeah we don't use them at our work but trialed them for a brief period as an alternative to what we grow in.

I can't recall exactly what they are called but they are like a fine plastic or some such thing, though i think its allegedly bio-degradable.

Probably no need to cut it out, the idea is that the plant can establish through it

[KIRKY]

Can’t say I have seen these before why not try and snip a bit off the top see if you can break it with your fingers. If it breaks easily shouldn’t pose a problem. It if stretches like nylon you will need to remove it.
Cheers
Kirky

[shibui]

One of the newer 'Jiffy' type propagating pellets.

jiffy.png

This one (from Garden city Plastics) does not appear to be exactly the same but I assume different makers have slightly different styles.
Description does not specify what the material is but they are designed to plant trees out direct into the ground so I assume the 'pot' will break down before roots are strangled.

[CommonCalluna]

Thankyou so much everyone for your help.

I'll leave them buried for this year, as Tim said the roots seem to have no problems at all growing through it, and I'd rather not cut in to such tiny delicate roots with my big clumsy hands.

Time will tell if they biodegrade as advertised or if future me gets to deal with the problem in next year's repots.

[dansai]

Did you investigate the state of the roots inside the mesh? I assume these were used for cuttings. Even if the mesh is supposed to break down, you may have roots that are a tangled mess inside this that you will have to deal with at some stage. Or even worse, one root coming off the cutting that has filled this little mesh pot that then goes on to fill the next size up and when you go to reduce the root mass are left with a tree that needs to be chucked in the bin. If its a young plant from a cutting I would remove the mesh, cut back the roots hard and go from there.

[Promethius]

Even if the mesh is supposed to break down, you may have roots that are a tangled mess inside this that you will have to deal with at some stage.

I’m with Dansai. I picked up a free Casuarina last year that had been grown in one of these. The plastic was tough and I doubt it would all have broken down any time soon. It certainly was preventing radial root growth. Had to cut back the single dominant root to nearly nothing and start again.

[CommonCalluna]

Did you investigate the state of the roots inside the mesh? I assume these were used for cuttings. Even if the mesh is supposed to break down, you may have roots that are a tangled mess inside this that you will have to deal with at some stage. Or even worse, one root coming off the cutting that has filled this little mesh pot that then goes on to fill the next size up and when you go to reduce the root mass are left with a tree that needs to be chucked in the bin. If its a young plant from a cutting I would remove the mesh, cut back the roots hard and go from there.

I had a look at the roots coming out. There appears to be a fine root ball on the inside of the net, with many healthy bigger browner roots growing out.
It doesnt appear to be stopping the growing of roots, but definitely not developing nice nebari.
I was able to pull most of the top layer of roots out for the rosemary and thyme, but I've been a herb gardener for ever and I'm not worried about tearing their roots I know they bounce back. I feel a little less cavalier about ripping into native roots in the current deluge. In fact I feel anxious.
In your experience would you think it better to allow the roots to get a bit stronger and clearer defined before trying to cut the net out, or should I bite the bullet and rip it out of the young white roots now?

Even if the mesh is supposed to break down, you may have roots that are a tangled mess inside this that you will have to deal with at some stage.

I’m with Dansai. I picked up a free Casuarina last year that had been grown in one of these. The plastic was tough and I doubt it would all have broken down any time soon. It certainly was preventing radial root growth. Had to cut back the single dominant root to nearly nothing and start again.

How did you go about removing the net? It sounds like you went for the cut back hard route, I'm a bit scared for the baby plants if I rip so much root off such a young plant. But I guess if I'm going to get serious about the bonsai hobby I'll need to face that fear sooner rather than later!

[KIRKY]

I would just run scissors down the sides of the mesh 4-5 downward cuts along mesh and then remove. It’s less aggressive.
If you remove some roots in the process I don’t see it being a problem. It will just be fiddly. You can even cut the long roots growing thru/under the mesh won’t make any difference.
Cheers
Kirky