Pinus densiflora. Japanese Red Pine. New challenge for NBPCA

[NBPCA]

Now at this point you probably think we are crazy? This is possibly the best angle for the roots, lower base, trunk and sharp bend but what about the foliage?
Well back to a better shot.

Pinus Densiflora16 - GH - 2010-11-2.JPG

We will need to remove the first branch that is now at the sharp bend.
We will also need to remove the branch about 2/3rds of the way up the tree. It has an unnatural bend and we can’t see how to keep it. It just doesn’t feel right.

[Jarrod]

Jealosy is a sin, and i am guilty of it with this tree. Densiflora is my favorite type of pine, and this is one of the best pieces of REd pine stock I have seen in Australia.

The options are endless, and i think it would really require a up close view to decide which way to go with it. May have to plan a canberra road trip soon

Unfortunately i dont have a laptop with photo editing software so a virt is out of the question however i feel a lean is required, with a few hanging branches. Not sure a cascade is the right option, semi cascade maybe, but informal upright to me looks like the best option.

Thanks for making me sin!

[kcpoole]

However today had another look and tilted it even more to the left and also more forward; like this.

this view woud be about what I orginally thought, maybe even more tilt, But what to do about the Thick branch running to the left from above the second bend?

Does not seem to be much branching on it to utilise. Can that be bent down?and made into a low branch?

Ken

[NBPCA]

That leaves us with a weakish lowest right branch and a lot of space to the top of the tree.
After having inspected the tree from the side we feel we can bend down the apex down to the right; thus distributing a lot of branching around a lower level and then bending a branch up to be the new apex.

Something like this.

Sketch of P densiflora 001.jpg

What do you think?

Grant

[NBPCA]

However today had another look and tilted it even more to the left and also more forward; like this.

this view woud be about what I orginally thought, maybe even more tilt, But what to do about the Thick branch running to the left from above the second bend?

Does not seem to be much branching on it to utilise. Can that be bent down?and made into a low branch?

Ken

Hi ken,

We looked and looked at that branch but the unnatural angle just kiiled it for us.

We will do nothing for the moment as we have only fertilised it twice with liquid and Seasol; and put some Osmocote on today.

We will leave all the branching in place for now and let the tree build up vigor.

The next step will be to remove the two branches we dont want; say in abot 6 months time and maybe do a light repot and lean it to the left some what.

Give it a year or so in the new angle then get stuck into it.

A long term project but a lot of fun and well worthwhile the effort.

Grant

[NBPCA]

Another option we have been considering is that of a semi cascade.
We would be using an angle similar to that in the photo below.

Pinus Densiflora8 - GH - 2010-11-2.JPG

This side of the tree has very little to offer in terms of good exposed roots, which is a downfall for many of the upright styles, but might be able to be disguised in a semi cascade style. With the help of a crescent style pot, we could both disguise the poor roots, and accommodate the root system as a whole after the drastic change in angle.
Here is an artist's impression of what might be able to be achieved.

Pinus Densiflora Semi Cascade 001.jpg

The first two troublesome branches would be removed, and a possible jin created from the second branch (ie. the one pointing downward).
The apex of the tree could be bent further downward to continue the flow of the "tail" in a convincing direction.
There are many small and supple branches in the top section of the tree, and with some compression, could form the foliage indicative of the drawing above.

What are your thoughts on this option?
It would be nice to get a discussion happening.

Leigh.

[Ash]

Hello Leigh,
I am going to sail a different tack here- just for discussions sake- and some food for thought.

It is very interesting from an Australian bonsai history perspective that this wodnerful Pinus densiflora was styled at one stage by John Y. Naka. I would be inclined to style this tree as best you can with a sensitivity to Naka's original work and change as little as possible in the primary elements of the tree (ie. trunk and branches). Bonsai is a unique art in that we continue to like to change pieces and make them better and update them to modern tastes. There are plenty of mistakes in some ancient and famous pieces of artwork (like paintings in chapels) but we try to preserve them as close to the original as possible to preserve a piece of history. I wonder will there be a day when we can say 'wow! that is a real 1970's bonsai...wow!'? Or will we only be able to experience these feelings from viewing photographs?

Tale a look at the article by Nishiyama (1996) on the re-discovery and styling of the famous netsuranari 'Shikishima'. The approach taken by the artists featured in this article was to try and return the tree to something akin to its original form from over fifty years before to shape it as close to what it was in 1937. They fortunately had photographs of the tree at their disposal.

Now that that is said I would like to see it retained as an upright tree. Does anyone know of any photos of its early days? Was the current front always the front?

Isaburo Nishiyama (1996) 'The First Netsuranari' Bonsai Today 1996-4 p. 43-48

regards
Ash

[aaron_tas]

hi guys

after reading this and seeing all of the images so far, i think you may have already chosen the front that im keen on.
the first artist impression, the upright form has the most interesting and strong lines, but i also think the foliage triangle should point left rather than right to emphasise the first movement out of the ground, and that first kink to the left up the trunk.

whatever the outcome, in your hands it will be a good one.

[NBPCA]

Hi all,

Grant here.

As you know I am partial to a nice cascade.

The cascade option can certainly done with the material but would be a radical departure from the original styling and we don't tend to do that here. As Ash has highlighted we need to be sensitive to the original design. Any drastic work we would only do with the complete input of the owner/artist.

The tree as presented with its original front has been as is since its first styling in the 1970s.

The original front is however defective in its root system but the 180 degree view keeps the original design concept alive but with better base now that it has grown on for 40 years almost.

Mr John Naka, the original artist and the former owner however would want the tree to refined and updated as necessary to keep it as a good bonsai.

Glad to see we finally got some discussion going.

There are another 2 or 3 options yet(all upright) to come from me so if anyone else has some input then please do so. Please come and view the tree in the flesh also. We are open 7 days 10am till 3pm.

Grant

[NBPCA]

OK,

Upright option no 2.

This involves trying to keep the branch with the sharp angle at the front.

If we remove most of the straight portion there is a more flexible branchlet behind it which may be able to be brought into a satisfactory place and angle from the trunk.

It may involve swinging the base about 10 degrees back to the right and bringing the front branch more forward; lessening the ugly angle that it comes from the trunk at. Otherwise technically it is not difficult and basically the same as option 1 but it does give more foliage mass to the left hand side.

JRP Upright option 2 001 - Copy.jpg

Grant

[Ash]

Hi Grant and Leigh,

This last style is very nice. It is like the front has changed but the feel of the tree has not. Does the trunk end up with a 'pigeon breast' in the upper portion from this angle? I would love to come and see it in the flesh but I am presently 1809.47 kilometres away (google earth Me to NPBC).

cheers
Ashley

[NBPCA]

Hi Grant and Leigh,

Does the trunk end up with a 'pigeon breast' in the upper portion from this angle?

cheers
Ashley

Not enough that it would be a problem and no more than in option no 1. In fact option no 2 could partially hide any pigeon breastedness obvious in option no 1.

Grant

[NBPCA]

Hi all,

Below is the Japanese Red Pine in original condition and to its original front.

View 1.JPG

When we first got this tree it was a bit yellow from lack of fertilizer and had not been repotted for many years. We took care of the fertilizing over the months we have now had it and it is looking very dark green and healthy.

We removed one dead branch and one live branch to simplify the lines and to help force growth into the remaining portions. The one weak lowest branch on the right (from the new front)is however still weak and only a repot could put it in a better location to get more sun and nutrient.

So last Tuesday we took advantage of the weather forcast and did a repot. We could still face high or low temperatures but this is about as good as it gets in Canberra. I don't want to repot too early because of the likely hood of high temps and don't want to leave it too long so that it is too cold or no chance of root growth by winter.

Anyhow we pulled the tree out of its pot and the soil was like a brick. We teased out the roots, removed only what we had to and then planted it at a new angle that is partway towards the angle I would like eventually. We could not go any further on the day so we will probably either have to repot again in a year or twos time to get the angle perfect.

Anyhow at its new angle the weak branch is more elevated and should get more sun and nutrient. This branch is vital to future designs so that is another reason for not stressing it until it is perfectly healthy.

IMG_3194 - Copy.JPG

IMG_3198 - Copy.JPG

Over the next few years we will do some wiring and trimming etc of most of the tree but the weak branch will only get light candle-snapping in spring.

Grant

[NBPCA]

Update!

After its emergency repot on February 28th 2011 the Red pine is in robust health and growing nicely with spring growth. The mix was 40% Diatomite, 20% Zeolite/Gravel, 20% Pine Bark Mini Nuggets, 20% Coconut fibre

Japanese red pine 2 001 - Copy.JPG

However the weak branch continued to deteriorate and die.

Japanese red pine 2 004 - Copy.JPG

We will now keep an eye on the tree to even out the vigour by very light candle snapping for the next month or so and then review its progress.

Shaping the tree is still a while off. We may yet need to do a graft on the right hand side or a bend. Time will tell.

Any how the tree looks safely through a dangerous period in its life.

Grant

[Dario]

Hi Grant, I am very sorry to hear that the weak branch that you had mentioned was vital to the future design of this tree died
Even though shaping is a while off, and as you mentioned you have the possibility of doing a graft on the right hand side (to replace the now dead branch), is there a chance that you may now choose to go in an entirely different direction design wise to compensate for the dead branch?
Or is the original plan still the best?
I know you said that you will have to monitor the tree to see how it goes before deciding etc...but I was just wondering if the latest developments will force you to look at the trees design differently know?
Thanks, and I hope it goes well! Dario.