Potters techniques discussed

[Bretts]

Thanks Asus Now I know we are looking in the right section maybe there are more there.
I am suprised there is not a section on texture type techs here but it is great info anyway.

[MelaQuin]

No bonsai artist starts with the same tree - it may be a black pine, maple, what have you, but the trunk, growth, shape is different in every tree. A potter buys the same clay that any other potter or would-be-potter can buy. If a potter is good enough to develop his/her own technique or glaze it is their right to keep that secret and avoid imitations. It is not a question of passing out information, it is a matter of maintaining your income base. For some artists [or would be artists] it is easier to copy than originate.... don't give them help. A good potter will be inspired by other styles but develop his/her own.

[Bretts]

No bonsai artist starts with the same tree - it may be a black pine, maple, what have you, but the trunk, growth, shape is different in every tree.

One part of Bonsai is seeing the tree in the tree. But bonsaists will go to great lengths to try to explain how to learn this. Other techniques such as growing trees from seedlings or whatever stage, soil mixes, pruning techniques and propagation what I think is one major buissness side of any bonsai nurseryman. I have not seen it in the culture of bonsaist to keep this stuff secret. In fact the culture seems to be the opposite to keep beginers intrested.

A potter buys the same clay that any other potter or would-be-potter can buy. If a potter is good enough to develop his/her own technique or glaze it is their right to keep that secret and avoid imitations. It is not a question of passing out information, it is a matter of maintaining your income base.

So are you suggesting that only professional potters keep his/her own technique or glaze secret.
This makes sense if you think of pottery as more like cooking. If a begineer gets hold of the secret recipie then they can make a soup as good as the chef? Hey If I found out KFC's secret herbs and spices maybe I can make millions

[Spinner]

Well Soltan, if you're going to copy Pat's fractured pots you're going to have to demonstrate an ability to 'throw'.....how about some proof of your prowess on the wheel?
If you can't throw well, and I mean very well, there's not much use in begging a process that relies on throwing to succeed!
Let me add that I don't have a problem with seeing a process that excites curiosity and then trying to duplicate it, but I do think you ought to try and nut it out yourself first and not expect everything to be handed to you on a plate.
A suggestion; why don't you contact Pat and have a chat to him....you might find him very approachable and no, I'm not giving you his number, do some legwork!!!

Spinner

[aaron_tas]

[Bretts]

I would like to answer these questions/statements but I think that would be folly until the simple questions I asked are answerd in some way otherwise this discussion will become even more useless.
I will repost these questions

It seems the secret techinque culture in pottery is explained as a necessity to protect income. Or possibly it extends further than this?
Are the techniques passed on to only those who have something to give back? Is it an only to my best friends culture?
I can pass it on to you but don't publish this?
Hobby or Business, is it only bussiness potters that have secret techniques?
Is it only trade mark techniques that are kept secret?
Is there any way some one nieve like me can understand what is ok to talk about and what is generally classed as secret knoledge?
Can potters give finished example of some of thier secret techniques?
Is there any example of a technique being exployted in the potting world(not the corparete world) that has caused the owner of the technique to lose bussiness or money?
I hope some frank answers on this will help my understanding.

[Bretts]

nice

[Spinner]

It sure is.....now ask Horst how he does it!

[Bretts]

I have

[Jon Chown]

God, give me the strength to accept the things I can not change, courage to change the things that I can and wisdom to know the difference.

Soltan, you either need to learn basic Economics 101 or you need to learn wisdom and gain strength.

Jon

[Bretts]

Hey Jon do you not watch the Simpsons. Marge has proven one crack pot CAN change the world
Although I did conceede now I would just like to understand

I may be nieve to try to convert Potters culture on this. I hope at least you can help me understand this culture as they say if you can't change the world you need to change yourself.

[PeterW]

Although I did conceede now I would just like to understand

I may be nieve to try to convert Potters culture on this. I hope at least you can help me understand this culture as they say if you can't change the world you need to change yourself.

Ok, so you are asking for help to "understand this culture as they say if you cant change the world you need to change yourself"........
Soltan, it is more a question of manners then actual culture, i believe. You requested that people tell you how to do something that could be considered as detrimental to their best interests. When they gave you their reply you didnt listen/read them. You repeatedly asked for the information. This in my opinion is rude of you. As they say Soltan....if you cant change the world you need to change yourself.
Regards
Peter

[Spinner]

...heh heh.... good one Soltan! I've got to admit I admire your perserverance. When you get an answer from Horst I'm going to bug you until you share it with me!

Spinner

[Bretts]

Lets look at my original question.

Ok potters I am a big fan of the crackel effect and I have had it explained to me once how Pat does his cracks but My brain is the sifting model and I need it again.
I know asking potters there formulas is taboo but I think that is not on, we are here to share info arn't we why should potters be excluded?

I have listned and thought criticly about all opinions put forward by members. I could pick out many instances were other members have not but that will not get us anywere.
I have agreed it is the right of any individual to not forward information. I have conceeded that it is nieve to think this discussion will change the culture. I have put forward some questions that would help me understand the culture that has formed around pottery information.
That is were this discussion has stalled as it seems no one is prepared to have a go at answering the questions. Instead they want to degrade my character.

[Bretts]

Spinner I got an answer but it was kept to PM's I have long wonderd why the information sharing is different with potters. The ladies who have a club that I am a member off are great and are very willing to teach. In fact some are ex tafe teachers. But still I get this underlying culture that you are not a potter of notariety if you don't have secrets. They do not know the crack effect or a few others that I have seen on pots that I like.
I like Horst's results better than Pat's to be forthright.
It is funny Here I am trying to understand Potting information culture. I want to explain what Horst told me but as it was given in a PM would I be out of order to explain it freely here. This is my conundrum. I would much like to discuss horsts tech here but my feeling of the culture is that I should not
As Lynette said Pats crack tech has been given out in a workshop. It now seems to me that Horst's tech is also common knowledge. Why should we not freely discuss them?

Asus found this http://www.potters.org/subject99452.htm
It is very similar to the explination Horst gave me except for the chemical(I will put this to the ladies and see what we come up with)
Horst also stated that after this he put extra clay behind the cracks to re-strengthen the pot. It has not worked for me yet but I have not tried with the chemical?