Lack of Sun

[Neli]

I have a light shade cloth over most of my trees...the material from which onion sacks are made,...Is that really bad???...Maybe remove it in winter??? My sun in Africa is rather strong.
I always thought Japanese maple does not like full sun, but trident can tolerate full sun.
Advise please. I am now worried.

[shibui]

Many people find that light shade is necessary to allow their trees to survive. Even I put up light shade when it gets really hot in summer and the trees do grow better for it.
I also believe that Japanese maple likes a bit of shade. I think that is why Scott posted the question earlier in this thread and my assertion that maybe these problems are not totally related to shade but a combination of factors including shade.

Bear in mind also that BB is talking about deep shade rather than light shade. Not sure what your onion sacking looks like Neli. The bags onions come in here is very open - 10mm holes with 1 mm thread which would equate to around 10% shade. if that is what you have it is VERY light shade and should not cause problems.
I like to give my trees as much sun as possible to keep growth compact but have found that some shade in the hottest months of summer is necessary to maintain health so I remove the shade as soon as weather cools down. Your conditions are very different so you will need to evolve your own management to suit. Try some expendable trees without shade or with shade only in the hottest times and see which grow better then make your own decisions.

[Neli]

Thanks Neil,
That makes sense to me. There are some friends in hot places like me that have not managed to grow junipers without a light shade. So I decided to try firs,t half of my junipers for 4 month in summer under shade. Within 3 month the ones under shade looked much better...just was and I am not yet sure how that will affect them in the long run. Now all my pines are in the shade also.
If I see some trees that are not doing well on full sun I also some how get a feeling that that is from the sun and as soon as I put them in the shade they do very well most of the times.
My water is also very hard...KH 170 GH 200 and PH 8.5. I add nails like John Naka, and the Japanese in the soil and add acid in all my water for watering.
I never put any water over the leaves of the trees...Some garden plants are totally white from lime deposits. But I dont see much problems from That.
And my trees that need dormancy are in the freezer now.


Some trees are behaving as if it is spring now...so I am not putting them in the freezer...Plan to do that when they look like going into dormancy....probably september...
What do You think? Any advise?

[Rory]

Many people find that light shade is necessary to allow their trees to survive. Even I put up light shade when it gets really hot in summer and the trees do grow better for it.
I also believe that Japanese maple likes a bit of shade. I think that is why Scott posted the question earlier in this thread and my assertion that maybe these problems are not totally related to shade but a combination of factors including shade.

Precisely

Bear in mind also that BB is talking about deep shade rather than light shade.

Again, precisely. even 50% shade is not a problem, if you get sun all day long. But really, I am talking about the fact that in the morning, we probably get sun peeping through from around 10.30 to 11 or middayish depending on the time of year, and it is continually just through tree top canopies, and then come about 2-3pm the sun is completely gone. So, ironically because of the angle of the sun in winter and the trees directly overhead, we probably get the best sun, dead smack in the middle of winter, with about 2 or 3 hours of filtered/strong sun. But throughout the rest of the year its bad. Often in winter, you can wait up to 4 days or so before some varieties need water. In summer, you can sometimes go 3 or even 4 days without watering too. But obviously this depends on the species. Like Taxodium Distichum still need water probably the most, and some prunus and citrus, but the others can go for a lot longer, because of the lack of sun.

[shibui]

What do You think? Any advise?

Any advice i give would just be a guess Neli because we have a real winter every year and I have never had to simulate cool temps. Winter appears to be a bit late this year though. We had light frost the last 2 mornings but quite warm overnight for the last month or so.

[Neli]

I will have to figure it out some how.

[kcpoole]

Such great info and knowledge here.
I have added the Info from this thread to the Wiki pages on shade here https://www.ausbonsai.com.au/wiki/index.php?title=Shade
and created this list of trees worthwhile trying here https://www.ausbonsai.com.au/wiki/index. ... Shadetrees
so that hopefully we will remember and have an easily referenced link to them

Thanks Buddyman

Ken

[Rory]

No worries, thanks for the kind words KC. I'll be adding to this post again later in the future, as I've got more stock I'd trialled to try and increase my attempts with other varieties a while back, but it is too early to be confident. From experience, I only add a species to the list after at least a year or 2 of trials. It has been a very taxing trial, losing much loved varieties, but also interesting at being able to know that I can confidently grow very strong shade tolerant species.

[Rory]

More natives that you can safely attempt if you have a distinct lack of sun:

Native

Acacia Parramattensis
Acacia Spectabalis
Callistemon Linearis
Callistemon Pinifolius
Callistemon Violaceus

I have come to realize that due to my insistence in pursuing Callistemons I have found these 3 to be of excellent material to use, from the numerous other species I have tried without much success.

Exotic

Taiwan Maples- If you insist on wanting a maple, I would be inclined to recommend a Taiwan Maple. They appear to perform the best out of all Maple varieties I have tried, but maples in general are not one to prefer constant shade.

However, I don't really bother much experimenting with exotics any more.

[Bush bunny]

I think this post is very very informative thank you. I am very conscious of temperatures, that can be gauged using a greenhouse thermometer, and of course your own garden environment and micro-climate zone. I am about to move my bonsais to a dappled shade but they do get light. But I did bring out the other day a fuschia, I've had it for years. I bring her/him in winter. But I put it out in the sun, and within a day some of the leaves turned partly white. Back into the shade dear for you. Because of the small soil volume, as well as your altitude (position of the sun as it moves around) I am watching the soil moisture all the time as the weather warms up here. (17 C day, sometimes frost, or 3 to 0 at night). Luckily so far, I have only lost a few trees, one evergreen bonsai starter Ilex, from scale. One conifer, don't know what type, from over eager root pruning and re-potting, my first attempt. The soil in it was rock hard. A port jackson fig, just didn't like the cold and moving into the house. Bought from bunnings, they credited me.
Some dragon trees, well they didn't survive the frost I'm afraid. And not gone yet, an Azalea Kurumi, that was originally planted in a double pot with no drainage holes. It has a white on the bottom of some branches. I will examine why, can't be calcium build up as I use only rain water. But it is throwing out new leaves. But because we are a frost and temperate area, one has to know too, what their natural environment would be like. And altitude they would naturally grow in. You can adjust it though of course gradually. I think the change over from winter to early spring is a dicey period here. With fluctuating temps during the day and night, as well as day time sunlight or shade. Cheers this was an intelligent post.

[jgmansell]

Thank you for such an informative and well researched post. It is articles like this that are an enormous help to beginners like me and I am sure there is much there for those who more experienced. Great work.

[Neli]

Bush bunny,
Remember that if you take a fuchsia or any plant from the shade and put it on the sun the leaves will burn and turn white...you need to slowly expose plants to more light.
Some of my trees are under very light shade...maybe half at 30% or somewhere there...and they are doing fine.
Yesterday I was looking at my bougies. I have many...They like sun....but the ones on the sun are looking miserable and the one on the shade are lush and green.
I suspect it is a combination of factors....
My bougies are planted in particles up to 10mm mixed sizes without fines, in 100% inorganic medium. I suspect it might get too hot in the soil.
Or the sun affects them badly in that small pot.
This week I am putting shade there also.

[aaronwithana]

This is a very helpful post, I only have about 1-2 hours of direct sun on my balcony in the morning then it's shady for the rest of the day.

My Japanese Maple, and a recent addition of the Crabapple don't seem to be responding to these conditions at all
I think I'll need to consider moving some more of my tree's to my parent's place so they can get some full sun in the backyard.

Prunus Blireana and the Chinese Elm appear to love it.

I had a poor little Acacia Howitii die on me but I think it was from overwatering and not the partial sun...
I think I'll have another attempt because I loved that little tree.

I'll definitely consider trying some of these other natives later down the track.
I'd love to see some pics of those Callistemons

[GavinG]

BonsaiBM, could we have some photos and information about the Acacias and Calls you are growing? I'm not familiar with any of them except C. linearis.

Many thanks,

Gavin

[Bush bunny]

Hi Neli, yes and I should have known that! Just not thinking this time enough, worried about my results from an ultra sound. They made a mistake with a CT scan (Thanks fellers I have been worried sick ) it's a tiny cyst, that is causing not bother. Nor likely too.