Cuttings, light and heat.

[WMC]

Hi all
Looking for some advice as i'm having my first go a propagating from cuttings. I have made a mini greanhouse using a plastic tub. It has a few air holes in the top and i have also set up a heat mat underneath it to keep my babies warm at about 21 degrees celcius. Currently i have the tub sitting inside the house on the floor at a glass sliding door for light. Other than normal house lights, i dont have any other lights set up so it is mostly reliant on sunlight from the sliding door.

My question relates to how much light is needed for cuttings. Should the tub be outside rather than inside for more light? Is what it getting enough?

I have read about cuttings being kept in darker environements but also read they should be outside but not direct sunlight.

Any and all discussion on this is welcome and appreciated.
BTW, my cuttings are Flowering Appricots, Japanese Maples, Japanese Dwarf Quince and Chinese Elms.

Thanks in advance.

[MJL]

Hey WMC,

I am sure horticulturalists will provide you a better answer but I find success using the simple seedling trays you get from the green shed. There are ll sorts of trays but any that have those clear, hard plastic tops with vents work for me. And they work more often than not.

When I strike cuttings, I dip them in hormone gel and drop them into the seedlings trays (just in a good quality seedling mix) which I have already sparked to make wet. When all the little seedling pots are filled - I cover and put into a shaded/dappled shade but light area outside. Vents fully closed. I don't need to water - the condensation creates it's own green house. And... wait. I don't open it up much in the first few weeks either ... I just let the green house be a closed greenhouse.

I'll take a photo tomorrow but it seems my cedar seedlings are going well; my nanking cherry cuttings are starting to sprout; my spruce cutting from autumn are going on and I even think some late autumn cutting from a Sharp's Pygmy Japanese maple are going ok!

[WMC]

Thx MJL
Interest to see how much light they get to.

[TimS]

I have 50 or so apricot cuttings just in mini greenhouses, and another 50 or so just in nursery pots with no cover to assess the positives and negatives of each method, no bottom heat though. They are out on the table under a big linden tree. At the moment they are getting lots of light and starting to show shoots beginning, and as the spring progresses the Linden will leaf out and protect them from excessive heat. I had good success with that method last year.

I've tried JM and quince cuttings but never had any success to speak of. I think i might be just too impatient with them though.

[shibui]

If they have no leaves there is no need for light. It is leaves that convert light into energy and food so no leaves means they don't need the light.
When there are leaves light becomes much more important. The more light intensity the more food the leaves can convert. More food means more growth, in this case roots.
'Inside a sliding door' can be a wide range of light levels. We have sliding doors on both the north and south side of our house. At this time of year the north side gets direct sun while the southern doors never see direct sunlight. When considering plants we need to be aware that we, as humans, have a very different perspective of light. What we consider bright is usually dim to most plants. That's why rainforest understory species are used as indoor plants. They are the ones that are adapted to the low light levels we prefer inside.
Direct sun is OK for plants but with direct sun comes heat. Temps inside a sealed container can climb quickly to dangerous levels so most people warn against direct sun. It all depends on the amount of sun, time of day, size of container and time of year. At this time of year, in my area, direct sun is usually OK for seedlings and cuttings but soon it will start to approach cooking temps so just a few hours would be prudent.

[WMC]

Thanks for the comments/advice...

I found the heat mat did not turn on at all yesterday (i have a thermastate set to 21 deg. cel.). The house warmth and the closed lid of the tub meant the media temprature got to 26 deg. cel. yesterday until i decided to open the lid to allow the temprature to drop. It eventually dropped back to 21 by the time i went to bed. I turned the heat mat off and this morning when i got up the temprature was still at 17.9 deg. cel with the lid only resting on the tub rather than clipped on. I do have air holes in in the lid of the tub but obviously not enough to counteract the warmth of the house. I think that my mini greenhouse (tub) being inside, the temprature is going to get to hot so i've now set the heat mat to 20deg. cel and just rested the lid on the tub at an angle to allow plenty of air circulation.
My understanding is that the media temp is more important that the air temp?
Based on the first day, with the house temp normally at 20-21 and the heat mat likely only coming on at night when the house cools after going to bed, i think the heat mat can stay set at 20 deg. cel. and the lid can remain resting on the top at an angle for air so it doesnt get to hot.

Any further comments/advice re the above are welcome.

Today i am going to set up a second tub with more cuttings which i will keep outside on my deck again with a heat mat set to 20 deg. cel. I'm assuming the lid will need to stay on outside to retain the temprature.
I will try and take some pics of both set ups once have the second mini green house done.

[MJL]

Hey WMC,
Here are some cuttings of a Nanking Cherry that I took on the 26th July - I have no idea whether they are rooting yet but it is somewhat exciting to see so many green buds!! This tray sat in a shaded area outside under trees for the first few weeks - outside temperatures fluctuated between about 2-3 to 15-17 during those weeks - but I am sure these were warmer in their sheltered little greenhouse. Now these sit in a lighter area and if the sun comes out they might get a bit more light ... still dappled - not direct. I still haven’t opening the vents but every now and then I lift the lid - like when I took this photo... as noted previously- when I put the lid back on - condensation re-appears within an hr or so.



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[Beano]

Sorry if it’s mentioned and I didn’t see it, but when did you start the cherry cuttings?


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[MJL]

Hi Beano, 26th July - 3 weeks ago.


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[Beano]

Hi Beano, 26th July - 3 weeks ago.


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Oh thanks, duh now I see it


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[shibui]

Bottom heat for cuttings is usually set so the media is just a bit warmer than the tops of the cuttings. I believe the actual temp is less important than having the base warmer than the apex. That is what helps stimulate roots.

[WMC]

Sorry if it’s mentioned and I didn’t see it, but when did you start the cherry cuttings?


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I see MJL did his cuttings late July. I did mine last week.

[WMC]

Bottom heat for cuttings is usually set so the media is just a bit warmer than the tops of the cuttings. I believe the actual temp is less important than having the base warmer than the apex. That is what helps stimulate roots.

Thanks Shibui
That was my understanding too. I'm finding it hard to achieve that in a mini green house as the temp sky rockets with the ld on. Learning as i go but i figure as i have a heat mat for warming the media, i'll control air temp by adjusting the lid as required. This way the Media should remain wormer that the tops

Didt get to setting up the second mini green house yesterday but will this afternoon and post some pics.

[WMC]

Finally got around to taking some pics.

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[MJL]

Strewth - to quote a 70’s term
- that’s a set up! I’ll be good to see how it all pans out and I reckon when you get to know the nuances of different cuttings and what works with heat etc.... you’ll have a veritable nursery in the making!


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