Crossed trunk Buddleja saligana (False Olive).

[lennard]

Louis Nel, known as the Buddleja King of South- Africa as well as the author of Buddleja Bonsai Buddy, visited our Kai today and he brought along this crossed trunk Buddleja bonsai:

buddleja crossed trunk.jpg

The rule of trunks not crossing was broken here brilliantly?

What do you guys think/

Lennard

[EdwardH]

The cross trunk doesn't look good
Having said that, the rules re cross trunks is all about the looks, not reality as seen in nature. There are plenty of examples in the bush. I am sure that as people push the boundaries of the traditional styles that bonsai as an art form can only benefit.

[Matthew]

I have to agree. I am drawn to it but not in a good way. The top canopy is nicely done . As edward said many trees like this grow in nature but somehow i cant see it working as a bonsai . Maybe im not thinking outside the square enough

[Guy]

doesn't that mean that he just chose the wrong front

[lennard]

The cross trunk doesn't look good
Having said that, the rules re cross trunks is all about the looks, not reality as seen in nature. There are plenty of examples in the bush. I am sure that as people push the boundaries of the traditional styles that bonsai as an art form can only benefit.

Louis do have some wonderful trees and he could have brought along "better" examples of Buddleja as bonsai. I asked myself why he brought along this tree?

He brought four other trees(mainly Juniper) but this crossed trunk Buddleja got the most attention. His other trees looked like, well....., good bonsai. Here is a Juniper he brought with him:

jpn1.jpg

I am thinking that he brought the Buddleja to the meeting to test our reaction ?

Lennard

[lennard]

I have to agree. I am drawn to it but not in a good way. Maybe im not thinking outside the square enough

When Louis styled a Juniper P. Nana as part of his demonstration he styled it as a tree who's main trunk has died and the lowest branch, going first horizontal for quite a long way, and then slanting upwards.

I told him that I would have chopped the tree at that lowest branch, use that branch as a new leader and repot the tree so that the old trunk slants - a nice semi-formal "normal" bonsai tree.

His response was that he wanted to portray a story with his tree but if he was not happy with the story unfolding he could transform it to a semiformal tree.

My personal opinion about Louis is that he is maturing as a bonsai grower and he is not "afraid" of the rules any more - he have to bend the rules to make the hobby still a challenge - and he don't have to prove himself or defend himself anymore( He is going to Brazil, China and Japan this year.)

Back to the Buddleja- over time the two trunk below the cross will fuse and you will see one nebari/trunk. A far few for this tree is better at this stage of his transformation. (Louis is using the word transformation quite a lot.)

Lennard

[lennard]

doesn't that mean that he just chose the wrong front

The two trunks are fusing where they cross - there can't be another "better" front.

Lennard

[Pup]

This tree represents Louis's fun Bonsai, as I see it. I cannot take it seriously. Thinking out side the square is fine BUT , it has to work this is the fun part.


Pup

edit typo

[Guy]

doesn't that mean that he just chose the wrong front

The two trunks are fusing where they cross - there can't be another "better" front.

Lennard

my tongue is still in my cheek

[bodhidharma]

This tree has nothing to recommend it. I studied it and tried to find a redeeming feature and couldnt. I do not think that the owner even likes it judging by it presentation. Didnt even bother cleaning the pot. You would probably think he went out of his way to break rules after years of following them and probably had a great time doing it. Good for him

[Bretts]

I think following the rules strickly and doing things in spite of the rules are both evils from the oposite end of the spectrum. I still find myself amazed by the guy that invented the rules. As I understand it one guy was in a way forced to come up with the rules for westerners so they could make bonsai. This set of rules put bonsai in a way that could be understood by western culture.
I am amazed because I think the guy that made them up was an absolute genius. I think the problem comes when we forget how they came about from a culture that does not have a written set of rules for creating bonsai.

Can't say I like this bonsai either. I think crossed trunk can work but this shows the many reasons they can not. Does not seem to be a logical story to how it happened. Then if it is just no obvious reason for it the tree has not settled into this growth form with straight trunks and umbrella tops. Everything just screams this is not real.
It could be an intresting challenge to make this work. I wonder if something could come from laying it over?

[lennard]

I think the biggest problem with the tree is not the trunks crossing but the two trunks not following each other - typical of the "dancing" trees:

dancing trees.jpg

The trunks crossing could be a nice focal point/attention grabber, but that is not enough to hide the other problems of the tree.

Oh well, I have learned something out of it?

Lennard

[GavinG]

To me, its a very strong tree, visually and dynamically, with very unusual balance and poise. I've looked at this photo a lot, and I've had problems with the tree, but it's very possible that I am the problem, not the tree. You have to figure out whether the "rules" are preventing you from seeing what is in front of you. Very graceful, and very challenging. Maybe I'll change my mind again tomorrow.

Gavin

[ozzy]

The tree is being very different, it probably realised it was different from a very young age, its more than likely having difficulties coming to terms with being different, quite obviously the tree is gay ... not that theres anything wrong with that.

[Andrew Legg]

OK, I have given this tree a lot of thought and my conclusion is that I don't think it works. To me it generates confusion. I look at it and I think to myself "how did this happen", and to be honest I can't figure it out. Why would it have grown like that? Now, sure as ducks have beaks, there are plenty of trees out in the wild that come across the same way to me. There is a big old pine in my neighbourhood that has complete reverse taper and branches going all over the show and the tree makes no sense, but it is completely natural.

So, can I imagine a tree growing like this one in nature? Sure. Does it make bonsai sense? No, to me not. Firstly there is no leading of the eye except to the cross over. This is not in my opinion a strong point of the tree, and yet it is the focal point. Having said that, I don't think this tree has a strong point! The trunks lack taper, the foliage lacks definition (at least from what I can see on the image), and there is nothing else about it that "wows" me.

My feeling is that this tree has been grown purely as a discussion piece and with little intention to be a high quality bonsai. All that said, beauty is in the eye of the beholder right, so who knows, maybe others have different opinions and that's fair enough. I'm not crazy about it though.