Disappointing nursery visits

[shibui]

Ray Nesci: they are really running out of stock unless you want some really big ones. Unlike few years ago, lots of choices.

When you are growing stock from scratch the way Ray and I do there is a limit to how many can be produced. It is also a cyclic business - stock is dug in winter then prepared for sale so the best choice is in late winter and spring. In this business you only get to restock the shelves once every 12 months. Many enthusiastic bonsai people recognise this factor and get in early and buy up the most promising stock. The later in the year you leave it the less choice you have. Maybe last time you went there was a different time of year?
This year I seem to have had more interest than ever before so my stock is also running low but nothing I can do to top up until winter. Even then, because last summer was so hot there will be few new trees of a standard I would usually put up for sale. Many will have to spend another year in the growing beds so my stock will be limited even at the start of the season.(Heads up everyone, Shibui Bonsai will have far less stock for sale in the coming year! - environmental factors beyond my control, sorry) hope that's not a 'pure for profit promotion'

Just offering some possible explanations for your disappointing visit.
It may also be possible that in a couple of years your knowledge has improved so that your expectations are now higher and you can see possible faults in stock that once would have had you drooling???

[DustyRusty]

last summer was so hot there will be few new trees of a standard I would usually put up for sale.

But does this also mean that rather than Tridents and Pines your figs did well and you have lots of those for sale this year?

Gee I love figs.

[shibui]

Alas no, Rusty. Sooky little buggers just can't handle a bit of cool weather in winter and the igloo is not large enough to grow more than a few at a time.

[Bougy Fan]

I find I hardly ever go to a bonsai nursery these days - as shibui mentioned you become more discerning and pass over stock you would have bought a few years ago. Also once you have been into bonsai a few years you realise you need to buy age and that can make for fewer purchases due to the naturally higher pricing.

[bonborn]

stock is dug in winter then prepared for sale so the best choice is in late winter and spring.

Thanks for the explanation. That makes sense.

[Qitianlong]

Just a note in regards to Ray Nesci's Nursery.
In regards to point B, Ray's system is much better, in that all the starter stock is $4, and all the starter trees in the 8inch tubs, which is just about the entire back section, just before the large stock, is all $12, so it is easy to gauge the prices. This makes C also defunct.
Once Ray works on a tree, it goes to the next level upwards with price tags on it, so you don't need to ask for prices on a 'missed one'.
For my own sake, I don't like getting surprises on prices, and Ray is always a pleasure to deal with, and I have found him to be the best and most fair businessman I have ever had the pleasure of dealing with. He has often thrown in free stock for my boy, and occasionally reduced prices on set bonsai when I have bought a lot.

don't get me wrong, I love Ray's, and Nic's. They're both awesome. Nic has become a good friend over the years and I think he's copped enough stick on here over the years to be honest. It's a tough business. If they don't succeed then we're all just going to have to dig up yamadori, ruin the environment doing so (unless they're privet or olive) like they've done in Japan, and have to sneak over to North Korea to start digging up their trees. It is a shame Nic wasn't there to help with the trees, of the 100 times I've been there he's always been there, so it is a real shame.

[Bonbon]

Ray Nesci: they are really running out of stock unless you want some really big ones. Unlike few years ago, lots of choices.

Just offering some possible explanations for your disappointing visit.
It may also be possible that in a couple of years your knowledge has improved so that your expectations are now higher and you can see possible faults in stock that once would have had you drooling???

Thanks for your explanation. That may well be a contributing factor that I got disappointed. I will sure go to Ray in Winter and try again. I love the way he always put a price on every single tree.
The price factor is very important to determine whether I interested in a tree. Like I got a budget of $1000, I sure won't bother to consider when the tree is labelled $3500. Does it make sense? But if the tree is unlabelled like those in Padre Pio, then I will struggle to ask especially when the chance is remote as experience will tell roughly how much a tree is worth. But if you don't ask, you won't know for sure. I always got surprise when asking the price in Padre Pio, but not in a nice way Shopping in Ray's place, you have a sense of certainty and rarely you have to waste your time asking for the price and wait for the owner to think and think right in front of you. You can hardly stop guessing what is going thro his mind. Should I pretend that I am not that interested?

[Bonbon]

It's a tough business. If they don't succeed then we're all just going to have to dig up yamadori, ruin the environment doing so (unless they're privet or olive) like they've done in Japan, and have to sneak over to North Korea to start digging up their trees. It is a shame Nic wasn't there to help with the trees, of the 100 times I've been there he's always been there, so it is a real shame.

I think Padre Pio will be very successful if he puts price tag on his trees like Ray and Bonsai South. I do wish him all the best for the future. He got nice trees. I will be a regular customer, as many others, if there are price tag.

[Aquaman]

I am new to bonsai and new to bonsai nurseries, but I visited Ray for the first time a few weeks ago.

I was really impressed. All the stock was nicely layed out, labelled and priced.

Ray was friendly and helpful. He spent lots time sharing his knowledge on a range of topics.

I wasn't there to buy mature trees, but I picked up a basket full of $4 starters, which are all doing well.

I also bought some pots, wire and soil ingredients.

Everything seemed to be reasonably priced.

So I was happy.

I'll check out Padre next.

[macca66]

Please,
If your running a business, the least you can do is let your customer know how much your product costs!
1 day a year? 1day every 6 months? 1 day per 1/4 ?

Make it east for your customer, I hate the awkwardness of having to ask.

[Bonbon]

Please,
If your running a business, the least you can do is let your customer know how much your product costs!
1 day a year? 1day every 6 months? 1 day per 1/4 ?

Make it east for your customer, I hate the awkwardness of having to ask.

Totally agree. Please help us to help you succeed. Let us advance the art of bonsai and pursue our dream tree together!

[Graeme]

I reckon Ray's is great. So great I even worked there for a while.

Hate going into any retail business who wont price their items. Usually don't go back the second time.

I have to disagree with you Q (I think it was you, sorry if not), but pricing stock isn't that hard, even Pre-Bonsai stock. 100 plants grown to size in 200mm pots should all be around the same value to the Nurseryman. So 100 PJ Figs in 200mm pots would all have a close enough value. Now sure, right now you're saying, "What about the better trees within those 100". Simple, I seperated them and placed them in a different area with a different price. When I put my "good" stock like this aside I changed pots to a different colour, or they went into a styro box if they were really special. So therefore, from the one gernmination of PJ seeds I could end up with some stock at $1.00 (the runts), $5.75 (for stock that stayed in 150mm pots, $9.75 for the not bad stock in 200mm pots. The prices for stock in pink, green and red 200mm pots varied between around $14.95 and $25.00. The stuff that went into styro usually started around $50 and usually individually priced, but mind you that was a few years ago. Wholesale pricing was different again, but used the same formula.

[lackhand]

I can't comment on any of the nurseries mentioned as I live in the US. I have, however, shared the disappointment of visiting a bonsai nursery only to be underwhelmed in a big way. The disappointment was multiplied for me because it was a five hour drive from my home, and that's the closest bonsai nursery. I got a couple trident twigs that will take 20 years to be anything, but at least I have a few tridents now. Oh well.

I've thought about starting a bunch of stock on my own and selling to others, but the mere thought of all that's involved gives me empathy for those that are doing it. It's a lot of work to get anything up to snuff, and then dealing with all the sales aspects of it when you're really in it because you love trees could easily be a bit frustrating. So thanks to those that are trying to make the difference, even if I'm not pleased with their efforts at the moment.

[Reece]

Padre was awesome when I went! Really nice dude! The pricing thing doesn't bother me..... Hes got enough work to do as it is.

[Bonbon]

Padre was awesome when I went! Really nice dude! The pricing thing doesn't bother me..... He got enough work to do as it is.

He is really a nice guy. Got great trees. But no matter how nice he is, we still don't know the price of his trees until we ask
IMHO, he will save lots of time and effort running around the nursery to answer customers enquiries of the price of the tree they interested. Hate to see him waste the time like that when he got so much to do. For the time and effort saved, he can grow better stocks. It is the clear way to succeed. Does it make sense? By then, he will be too busy to collect cash from customers though, like me and so many others.
Also, in case he is not on site, anyone can sell the trees for him if they are all priced. Does it also free him up a bit?:hooray: