Advice on my only Mugo Pine

[MoGanic]

I concur that repotting should occur now however, if your tree is not 100% in health, I'd be concentrating on simply getting it into a good quality soil and removing only the dead/rotted roots as Bodhi suggested. Angle changes and root reduction can be done once the tree is healthy and vigorous.

Hi Mo you have summed it up nicely for me. People so far have been great and all seems to hum to the tune of repot now minimizing root work where possible.

This is what I needed to hear so thank you all very much!

One more thing, my current mix should I wash out the soil or can I just add say more diatomite/zeolite/pine nuggets/pumice?

I heard though memory loss of something that promotes the fungi.. anyone have an idea what this could be

hmm was it soil? some compound? spray? solution mix? I really cant recall

Pines usually harbor growth of mycorrhizae, which is a beneficial bacteria that grows as extensions of the fine feeder roots and assist in uptake of nutrients for the host plant. This will happen with any healthy pine, though I'm not sure if Mugho also does.

What I do know, is the soil component in your mix is likely to do more damage than good. Best to keep it out to allow free drainage. Note that roots grow when the soil is aerated and does not stay wet, and the fine particles in soil wont help with that at all!

If you're itching to do some more work on it, clean out the rotted wood and apply a weak solution of lime sulphur - don't get it on the live areas and don't create any new dead wood either! Let it heal! The rotted wood is already dead and so can be worked. Just need a tooth brush and water to clean it and something to scrape out any soft bits. Then mix the lime sulphur at a 50:50 ratio with water and apply it to the dead wood. It will help stop rot.

Keep us posted!

Regards,
Mo

[Inspired]

Great tips Mo! I will rework the potting mix and roots and deadwood lightly.. perhaps as earlier suggested I wont worry about positioning so much as the angle I am thinking of wouldn't be appropriate at this time.

Cheers!

[shibui]

I have also repotted my mughos at this time of year so no problem doing it now.
Stop worrying about fungi. Michorryza help trees grow in poor, nutrient deficient soil. They will grow just fine without it if you feed properly but very pine I have has heaps of michorrhiza in the mix anyway, even though I use a very open mix.

re soil mix. I would start again. How much will it cost to scrap the bit you have already mixed and start again? Soil in potting mix is really asking for root problems as you have already found.
You can (and should) remove all dead roots - that will have no effect on the tree because they are already dead - obviously. Removing them will remove a source of re-infection as well.
I think you could also cut back live roots as well. Tree looks reasonably healthy and I know we can cut back far more than most people think without harming the tree. From your questions I am 99% sure you, like most growers, will not have the fortitude to cut too much.

[Guy]

I've just killed two mugos--so my only advice is "don't listen to me"

[Inspired]

I've just killed two mugos--so my only advice is "don't listen to me"

Hey Guy.. sorry to hear. How did you do that?

[Inspired]

I have also repotted my mughos at this time of year so no problem doing it now.
Stop worrying about fungi. Michorryza help trees grow in poor, nutrient deficient soil. They will grow juut it if you feed properly but very pine I have has heaps of michorrhiza in the mix anyway, even though I use a very open mix.

re soil mix. I would start again. How much will it cost to scrap the bit you have already mixed and start again? Soil in potting mix is really asking for root problems as you have already found.
You can (and should) remove all dead roots - that will have no effect on the tree because they are already dead - obviously. Removing them will remove a source of re-infection as well.
I think you could also cut back live roots as well. Tree looks reasonably healthy and I know we can cut back far more than most people think without harming the tree. From your questions I am 99% sure you, like most growers, will not have the fortitude to cut too much.

Hi Shibui how open is your mix and what size particles? I was just outside observing the soil, killed what seem to be one of those flies that lay the lavae and a funny looking drill looking type bug with no legs which is another worry. I was thinking of just adding more course particles into the potting mix but after reanalyzing how it looks and reading your post I will start afresh! This alone could saved my Mugo! The root rot goes deep, well into the root ball and Im afraid of doing further damage to of whats left of live roots. It seems you have alot of confidence with your trees which I have yet to achieve. Still its very encouraging to hear that we can perhaps take off more than what others think possible.. I'll take this all on board along with earlier info and I'm sure all the info will prepare me well for my individual medley relay!

Wish me luck!

[Guy]

I've just killed two mugos--so my only advice is "don't listen to me"

Hey Guy.. sorry to hear. How did you do that?

I can't work out if it's kindess or neglect-- ----my record with mugo is not good---no more ----- --NO MORE!!! -----

[Inspired]

It is a shame really everytime we lose "our precious"

Without knowing cause & effect how can I copy / not copy you if you can't tell me what it is that you killed your Mugos

[shibui]

Hi Shibui how open is your mix and what size particles?

The mix I have been using is around 40% propagating sand (around 3-6mm) 60% pine bark (6-10mm) - was supposed to be 25% sand but I think the loader driver overestimated- with around 10% maidenwell added. The pine bark had quite a bit of finer material in it so there is some under 6mm material. I decided that mix was a little too open so have changed this year to a new supplier
Now 8 parts 3-6 mm pine bark and 2 part propagating sand (with fert and trace elements added). I am still adding around 10% maidenwell diatomite. This 3-6 mm bark is well screened and has very little fine material in it and the new mix looks and feels very good.
In previous years I used a mix from ANL from Sydney - around 20% 3-6mm sand 80% graded compost or composted pine bark? by the look of it. I could not get a breakdown from them. It was usually good but then I got some bad batches with lots of very fine material which was no good for my use - I had to put it over a 3mm sieve before use - so I am now trying Melbourne suppliers.
Essentially I am looking for a mix with 3mm+ particles - some organic to retain moisture and some hard particles to maintain structure as the mix ages.

My trees have grown well in all these mixes which reinforces my assertion that there is no 'best' mix. Bonsai will grow in a wide range of mix as long as you match your management - watering/feeding, etc - to it.

[bodhidharma]

I repot mine in August so you can do it now. I would go slowly and sort through the roots taking out only the dead ones and just clean it up a little

- Your repot in August Bodhi did you do much root work and how much did you take off? Have you repotted many Mugos over the years during this time?

-Yes, a few and always with success. I was a bit cryptic about soil and soils aint soils! I also use a very high quality potting mix and then i add purlite/scoria/pine bark to the mix. Shibui is leading you along the right path and he is correct when he says that if your potting mix is working stay with it. there is more than one to skin a cat .. so to speak.

[Inspired]

Great tips gents and thank you for sharing.

Shibui are you looking for pine bark? I'm not sure whether they are the same as pine mini nuggets but I think the particle sizes are great (for my small-mid size trees) and they seem to last forever without much breakdown at all. I leave mine in the sun (somehow the bag opened up) and when I went to wash it, I noticed the water was clear as. Perhaps sun, rain and open air cleaned it for me

You guys probably already know and have your own suppliers though just in case, I bought mine from Wayn at Aus Orchids. I bough 6 bags (they send it) and still got 4 bags left this was years ago too

Sphagnum Moss.. tempted to put some of these chopped in or should I just topp up pine nuggets like Shibui for added moisture?

[Inspired]

Oh btw, what trace elements or other fertz do you put in the mix?

[rodm]

Hi inspired,
I've looking at your post off and on since you started it. Looking at the pics, man ,you have some awesome material. Very jealous. Where did you get it from? Will be great bonsai for the future
Cheers Rod

[Inspired]

Hi inspired,
I've looking at your post off and on since you started it. Looking at the pics, man ,you have some awesome material. Very jealous. Where did you get it from? Will be great bonsai for the future
Cheers Rod

Rod I would love to tell you that I climbed to the elevation of 6000 feet just to collect this guy but I didn't

Maybe we should go and disperse thousands of seeds on rocky mountains for future gens..

Yes I've been hard looking to get something that resembles those that grow wildly (similar to those contorted ones found in US and Europe) and this is the closest I have come.

I love abstract and pines bring these out beautifully.

I bought it off a gentlemen that just left it growing uncared for (the way we like it) so since in my possession I have cut off long leggy limbs.

I wish I could find another and just let it grow freely to build mass and size.

Has anyone seen wild twisted pines anywhere in AUS? I'd love to go collecting (where permission is granted) would be so much fun!

[Guy]

It is a shame really everytime we lose "our precious"

Without knowing cause & effect how can I copy / not copy you if you can't tell me what it is that you killed your Mugos

I think it was a bad 'grow pot' choice -very flat base and small drainage holes- placed on timber plank -added up to poor drainage and waterlogging---