AusBonsai

Some of my young Larches could do with some de-feminising too

MM

Hi Fella's , yes it does work on deciduous trees as they attempt to sprout roots , basically layering themselves . The knife slashing method works on Pines .PINUS Nigra "European black pine i have here has had it done .

Kimura makes mention of the North /South side of a tree and his advantage because of this aged difference . I do have a couple of Pines here which have had the Trunk slashing method used , you have to be cautious they can bleed quite heavily and the result is die back or death .Cheers Alpineart

Graeme is right you do do it up and down not around and yes this is from collin lewis I've never tried it but collin had a pic of it working and I'm sure it's not fake because I always see trees here with all kinds of moss in their trunks and they reeally look old eventhough the tree's trunk isn't even 1 foot long.

Jamie wrote:dunno ant, i would like to know aswell though. im all for finding quicker ways to do things but i also think that its bonsai and some things should just not be rushed or sped up

Thats my point jamie, If this is such a great idea (and it might possibly be) the Japanese would be doing it. i dont know wether they are or not hence why i put the question up. I certainly have not read it or heard it from the japanese.

Alpine quote
Hi Fella's , yes it does work on deciduous trees as they attempt to sprout roots , basically layering themselves . The knife slashing method works on Pines .PINUS Nigra "European black pine i have here has had it done .
Kimura makes mention of the North /South side of a tree and his advantage because of this aged difference .

Alpine i have 4 yr old tridents that look as aged as that and have never had this treatment. Kimura uses a north facing brick wall to put the tree up against, in order to age the bark. no wrapping or scratching though.

SO do the Japanese use this technique for they are the ultimate measuring stick.

Hi Ant the Trident was as smooth as a babies bum before i placed the moss .The callousing /dimple effect is a direct result of the wet moss .No i didnt sandpaper or scratch . As i said Kimura makes mention of the North/South side of pines "the bark"being different "age wise" and uses this to his advantage , no mention of him or anyone else in Japan using it .Cheers

Ant, maybe when ya got 600 year old trees ya dont need to add aging.....lol

Antonio
SO do the Japanese use this technique for they are the ultimate measuring stick.

So why is it not good enough when they airlayer new roots on a beech

Bretts wrote:

Antonio
SO do the Japanese use this technique for they are the ultimate measuring stick.

So why is it not good enough when they airlayer new roots on a beech

do you really want shaggy fissured bark on a beech?

Off course I am suggesting that if the Japanese are the ultimate measuring stick then why is it not good enough when they air layer a beech to create new roots.
Kinda like having your cake and eating it too. You can't have it both ways

I have heard of many techniques for aging bark over the years but I think there is no substitute for years. In retrospect time passes very quickly and the bark on your trees will develop nicely just left alone. I believe energies are better spent improving other aspects of bonsai and let the bark take care of itself.
Craig

It is ok too layer a beech when they do it to get rid of a bit of straight trunk or reverse taper etc !!! But ya still dont get it. Now this thread is not about layering or havent you noticed ??? !!!

Hi Craig that is a fair point. I was thinking about it last night and the true worth of a tree is when the bark ages right to the tips of the branches and obviously that is not going to happen with this technique.
But after seeing the pictures of the results I am certain that this can be a handy technique. If Colin thought it worth while to pass on it must have some merit he is no slouch when it comes to quality trees

anttal63 wrote:It is ok too layer a beech when they do it to get rid of a bit of straight trunk or reverse taper etc !!! But ya still dont get it. Now this thread is not about layering or havent you noticed ??? !!!

You can't use the Japanese as the ultimate measuring stick in one thread and disregard them in another! Whether you air layer to get rid of a straight section or to get rid of bad roots the result is the same Only looking with tunnel vision can that not be got!
As your ultimate measuring stick states

Without layering you would not have created such a perfect nebari

Sorry to take this away from the topic... that of aging the trunk when a layer is removed & planted up the roots are buried, so there is no need to use the moss wrapping technique to preclude light/increase moisture. The surface roots are kept buried for the first few years before slowly being exposed to sun & wind.

Back on topic.... Yes the japanese do make use of the moss wrap technique along with many others (as stated, kimura using shade/sun) to age the trunks. I experimented in the early days with all sorts of different things including nailing all up & down the trunk of a tree, in theory it was said to help thicken & age the trunk quicker. It worked BUT left awfully unnatural looking bark that i finally had to rub off. 10yrs of hard earned bark lost because i didnt have the patience in the beginning to let nature take her time.

I have a tree that i am growing on that this will not work on. The area of trunk that was below ground level is fine smooth & white, the bark above original soil level is thick fissured & grey. Am hoping that the course of a few years will bring the 2 areas into harmony.

Matt

Hi Brett,
I have no doubt these techniques work and have no problem with their use. I am sure they do the trees no harm at all. But in the long term I think they probably make very little difference and in the end bonsai is all about long term.
Craig