I Need advice for this elm

[Mojo Moyogi]

Hi there desdesign,
unfortunately I don't have time to do a virt for you or go into too much detail, but I do have time to outline my thoughts. Before I begin, I would like to mention that I see a great many trees on this forum and elsewhere that I simply wouldn't want to own. But I would make room for your tree on my benches. Conditions apply.

This tree has branches that I would not tolerate, they would go.
This tree has shoots that could be anything, I would utilise them.
This tree is a Corky Bark Elm, it will shoot anywhere, even in the clumsiest of hands.
This tree has a pleasing flared base, I would do it justice.
This tree has a trunk that has taper, then it does not, then it does again. I would rectify the trunk where it first becomes confused.
The same could be said of movement.

Again, I read about holding on to "established" branches and trunks because they are there. Because they are old. Because they have lovely, aged bark. Because someone took the time/went to the trouble of growing them. Hanging onto height for the sake of having a large tree. Why not build a better large tree! I'm sorry if what I have written offends anyone's long held bonsai sensibilities, but I find that to be flawed thinking from a design perspective. At least flawed in regards to what I expect and love about this Art of Bonsai.

Cheers,
Mojo

[anttal63]

Its all good Des dont take it personal do whatever tree your heart desires.

[LLK]

To Andrew: thanks for the virtual of the "tilted" tree. Gggggrrrr...iiiiiinnnn.....
I read with great interest your reply to Anne. Thanks for that too. If all beginners were like you, bonsai would make huge strides in no time, wherever it's practised.

To Bodhi: you are wisdom personified as always. (I think.)
To Mojo: great answer. This is a very short appraisal, and I apologise. Just don't have anything to add.

To Des: congratulations on your new tree. You are set for a busy Spring, meseems! Have lots of fun.
I have seldom enjoyed a thread more than this one. To all participants: you are a great bunch of guys. Agreeing with one another or not, that's not the important thing. What matters is to have your say, sensibly and kindly. That was done.

My apologies to all to whom I didn't reply, but if everyone conscientiously does that, it makes a thread so terribly wearisome to read.

I guess I should have at least acknowledged Grant's weighty contribution with photo of a corky bark bonsai, no doubt it's a masterpiece.... Sorry, Grant, I think it has all the beauty of an elephant.
Your lesson re: pruning to the first branch is most apt. Personally, I've got several trees that were developed in this way, and I never regretted adopting that process.... in their particular case.

Bye, all!

Lisa

[Andrew Legg]

To Andrew: thanks for the virtual of the "tilted" tree. Gggggrrrr...iiiiiinnnn.....
I read with great interest your reply to Anne. Thanks for that too. If all beginners were like you, bonsai would make huge strides in no time, wherever it's practised.

To Bodhi: you are wisdom personified as always. (I think.)
To Mojo: great answer. This is a very short appraisal, and I apologise. Just don't have anything to add.

To Des: congratulations on your new tree. You are set for a busy Spring, meseems! Have lots of fun.
I have seldom enjoyed a thread more than this one. To all participants: you are a great bunch of guys. Agreeing with one another or not, that's not the important thing. What matters is to have your say, sensibly and kindly. That was done.

My apologies to all to whom I didn't reply, but if everyone conscientiously does that, it makes a thread so terribly wearisome to read.

I guess I should have at least acknowledged Grant's weighty contribution with photo of a corky bark bonsai, no doubt it's a masterpiece.... Sorry, Grant, I think it has all the beauty of an elephant.
Your lesson re: pruning to the first branch is most apt. Personally, I've got several trees that were developed in this way, and I never regretted adopting that process.... in their particular case.

Bye, all!

Lisa

Nice post Lisa. I think it just reinforces the fact that most of us here on Ausbonsai are debating in good spirit (I think that applies to all of us in this thread) and it is so great to be a part of that! One thing I firmly believe is that we should do bonsai for ourselves as this is how we get the most enjoyment out of it. It is important to learn good technique and design principles, but at the end of the day, our trees must speak to us as their owners. This is why it is so important that we learn from others and apply what we learn in a fashion that appeals to our sense of beauty/style and the vision we have for each of our trees! This ties in very importantly with the fact that we all have different tastes, so it makes none of us right, and none of us wrong. It is only when we start to apply rules from book that we get into the realm of right and wrong, and that's a bit sad as some of the rightest things I've seen are also some of the wrongest by the rules!

Thanks for the compliment, but more than I'd like to admit, my energy and experimentation is driven by others with who accompany me on this journey in the gentle art of bonsai. Thanks to them.

I end my post by including a photo of a tree by a local artist Vicky. I'm sure she will not mind my dropping it in here. The photo was taken at our bonsai show at the city's arbour day celebration and it is a pomegranate. It too has a prominent curve and is a very beautiful and praised bonsai here locally.

IMG_6396_cr.jpg

[bodhidharma]

Nice post Lisa. I think it just reinforces the fact that most of us here on Ausbonsai are debating in good spirit

I agree, Lisa is a great contributor and adds a feminine point of view with authority.

[GavinG]

Des, by the time you digest all this you'll be wise indeed.

May I suggest that you don't do anything drastic until you can see for yourself why and how it works. It's an excellent choice of tree, and a great problem to set yourself. Thanks to all.

For my money, that large sweeping curve will eventually look clunky to you. The strong early shapes in the trunk don't match with the almost circular curve. Most trees tend to a direction and have a strength - this one can't make up its mind. The lack of taper and the sudden stop don't help. Certainly be impressed by the texture and the potential in the trunk, but you may find clearer stronger lines if you layer some of the top off, and cut the trunk off just above the first left branch. It may seem like a waste, but you're not losing the top, just re-making it, and the line off to the left is full of power.

Don't take my/our/their/anyone's word for it - cover up parts of the tree with cloth and see if the line that it makes comes alive. Select the bits of the top you want to layer the same way. A trunk that doesn't move fluently won't ever get better by developing branches. It's your eyes, and your mind that are getting the big workout here. I don't trust virts all that much myself - too much wishful thinking and guesswork. If you can't see what the trunk should do, keep looking.

And best of luck. You've certainly stirred the mud at the bottom of the pond, well done.

Gavin

[LLK]

From Andrew:

I end my post by including a photo of a tree by a local artist Vicky. I'm sure she will not mind my dropping it in here. The photo was taken at our bonsai show at the city's arbour day celebration and it is a pomegranate. It too has a prominent curve and is a very beautiful and praised bonsai here locally.

Soooooo elegant!
Really, there's nothing you can't express in bonsai, so long as you know how.

Many thanks for all the kind words.... aw shucks.....

Lisa

[Mojo Moyogi]

Andrew, Vicky has talent.

Love the creative debate guys and gals.

Cheers,'
Mojo