pit fired pots

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Neli
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Neli »

Darling, I thought you will laugh at me....I can not find anything here...so I make everything my self. Do You see the red hips behind the wire rack?
That is DIY soil. Village made bricks, not too well baked...crushed and sieved for media I call it Zakadama :lol: Also I bought 10 ton gravel that is almost half of it laterite...sieved it all, washed it and I am ready for spring. Also large sand, charcoal and compost are ready.
I am supposed to be an engineer so it helps a bit.
Last edited by Neli on July 3rd, 2013, 10:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian Bee »

Far out Neli :whistle: , you are doing great. Looks like you will be very busy this spring :tu:
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Neli »

Yes Darling, not much to do now so I thought I get ready for spring...I want to do root work on all my trees.
I ask lots of questions that sound like suggestions. Please remember I am a inquisitive newbie trying to figure out why You made a particular decision, in order to learn.
I started a blog:http://nelibonsai.wordpress.com/2013/07 ... a-nursery/
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by vgarth »

Goodday,
for cheap pots made with not too much equipment or knowlegde, as well as trying out the ciment fondu (oxides for colour) over shadecloth stitched to chicken wire frames, which works ok, also try making pots from styrofoam.

Easy enough to collect styrofoam for free. Cut to shape with a bread knife or a hack saw blade not in a frame. (Put some sturdy tape around one end of the hack saw blade to create a handle.) Glue together with something like Maxbond, construction glue. You need the gun thingy with the trigger to put the long tubes in. But in Aus these are not expensive. Let the glue set for a day. Then start painting, water based paint. Acrylic paint. Don't use an oil based paint, it dissolves the styrofoam I believe.

It's probably easier to make "rocky" looking planters with the styrafoam than neat perfect flat-finish ones. Some people make it very rocky looking by scratching the finish with a fork - messy but effective. (Do this just after the glue stage) Then if wanted, paint over with mineral turps - the foam starts dissolving, melting away. When you are happy with the look, wash it well in warm soapy water to stop it going any further. Dry for a day or two. Then start painting the colours you want. This is used more to make fake rocks and mountains for your bonsai landscapes - a big advantage being the light weight. That's what I learned it for first, but sometimes I make the whole planter or pot from styrafoam. As I said, it usually looks like the bonsai is planted in a rock, not in a ceramic pot. Here's a few pictures of some I've made, and how they looked before painting up for colour.

Warning: bonsai roots grow into stryofoam, so I don't know about repotting. May destroy the container to do so.... And if you try to pull a bonsai out of a styrofoam container, the roots may well rip off the bonsai and stay in the styrofoam, at least that happens if one strikes cuttings in a styrofoam coffee cup then tries to remove them. It may be necessary to put a layer of mortar or ciment fondu on the inside of a styrofoam planter to deal with this, I'm thinking of trying that. For fake rocks that bonsai are planted beside or onto, often they are not being separated from the rock for repotting, so it's not an issue.
P1100014.JPG
P1230031.JPG
Hidden Valley.JPG
P1100019.JPG
P1230033.JPG
How some of the styrofoam planters look as they are being made:
P1100026.JPG
Best of luck
Val Garth
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian79 »

Hi Val
what a creative idea. im not sure I like the idea of roots growing into the foam though :lost:
looks cool otherwise :cool:
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian79 »

Hi guys
Can anyone recommend a type or brand of clay that they have had success with.
I'm going to have s stab at pit firing over the next few weeks.
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Neli »

Very nice Styrofoam,
a friend of mine covers it something like cemen called rockset, and they are for ever then and roots dont grow inside. I made a slub from concrete with stones yesterday..3 tory...like 3 levels for planting on it.
I ask lots of questions that sound like suggestions. Please remember I am a inquisitive newbie trying to figure out why You made a particular decision, in order to learn.
I started a blog:http://nelibonsai.wordpress.com/2013/07 ... a-nursery/
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by vgarth »

Damian, Feeney's red raku. But there's a lot you need to learn to work with clay. If you can't afford/access a class, at least borrow a library book!
Neli, thanks for tip re Rockset.
cheers all,
Val Garth
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian79 »

Thanks Val, ill look into it. :cool:
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Lynette »

Try Feeneys BRT or any clay with some grog if you can not get feeneys. The grog helps with the shock of unpredictable firing conditions. Its easier to use for people with out a lot of experience in making pots, but remember to dry the pots slowly.
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian79 »

Thanks Lynette
I plan to order some Clay from Walkers in Melbourne, they have this Clay I believe. One Question:
Why would that Clay be better than a Stone ware or Earthenware Clay? after firing and Glazing, will it be matured enough to use for Bonsai?
The kiln Im looking at building, I believe, should be capable of reaching temps for at lest earthenware but the only way Ill know for sure is to build one. :fc: :fc: :fc:
I appreciate the input, thanks. :cool:
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Lynette »

Hello Damian,
Earthenware temperatures are not thought to be vitrified enough to withstand the constant wet dry conditions, especially if in freezing, snow or frost conditions.
They may last for a while, but current thinking is no, however I have a raku pot (Feeneys BRT), that has been going for years. but I have never lived where there is frost.
Usually the pots for raku firing are bisque fired to a 1000 to help with the thermal shock from the raku kiln
Raku clay has grog in it so that it can withstand fast changes in temperatures, that tend to happen in a Raku kiln. Red raku has a more terracotta colour, where as the BRT has a more biscuit colour if you can fire above 1200.
If you really are thinking about making a kiln for only a little more expense you could make one that would fire higher.
Have a look in you local library for a book called Alternative kilns and firing.
I am doing a raku firing this weekend with a friend. it can be dangerous and you should have water and somebody else around if possible.
Hope this helps. If you go to Walkers you will get lots of help with any questions you have.
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian79 »

Hi Lynette
Firstly, thanks for taking the time to respond to my questions, I really appreciate the effort. Let me see if I have this correct:
Raku clay ,if bisque fired above 1000 deg-c, will be ok because it has more grog so it can withstand temp change, there for it would handle a colder climate better? eg. Frosts. (It was 1 degree here yesterday morning)
(Please correct me if Im wrong :palm: )
I get the earthenware bit, Ill stay away from that type of clay, Im still just a bit hazey on the raku side of things. I love the Raku finish but if the Clay is no good for me climate, Id be better of with Stoneware? Downfall is, it needs to be fired at a much higher temp 1000+ for bisque, higher for glaze?
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Lynette »

Hello Damian,
I think you have just about got it. I have had an earthenware pot that I made at hobby ceramics (before I took up pottery), that I have had for 20 years, but I have never lived anywhere where it got below 0 and that was only infrequently. That pot was fired to 1100 twice, theory is that may make it stronger.
What I have been told if you live in a cold area the freeze thaw cycle will crack pots and I have seen photos from USA of pots that have broken apart from that cycle. I have been told that low fired pottery is more susceptible to this cycle. If you are only making them for your self and can't get any other pots it may to worth a try. If you go to walkers in Melbourne try asking about ciement fondue, it doesn't need firing and there is information about on the internet for making bonsai pots from it. I have a book with information, can't remember the name at present. I will have a look later.
Living so far from bonsai nurseries etc does make it hard to get pots so you just have to try with what ever you can do. The pots I use are much larger now and I just feel more secure with them high fired. I also sell pots so I have to make sure that they will last.
Polystyrene is not worth the effort I have used it several times and even with several coats of paint and sealer, heavy weather will damage it eventually.
Happy to help if I can.
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Re: pit fired pots

Post by Damian79 »

Once again, thanks for your reply Lynette. I have decided to go with either a raku clay fired at stoneware temps or just go with Stoneware clay.
I plan on hopefully one day becoming proficient enough to sell my pots, but baby steps first :palm:
The main problem I have is actually firing my pots. Im looking into a number of avenues to get around this problem, with the main goal to eventually have my own kiln. Gas, Electric, im not sure yet which to go with.
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