AusBonsai

Hi Loretta - the same as Ken, the trees I had the problem with were just in normal commercial potting mix. That was many years ago before I knew anything about specialized mixes and non-organic mixes.

I have had the same stuff on some of my figs in diatomite. I took the top layer of diatomite off with the black slime, and dried it in the sun for a few days. The slime dried out, and washed off, then I reused the diatomite. Again, it is only on the trees that are more in the shade, and ones that were root-bound. Didn't affect any of my trees though, but I didn't leave it there for months.

Glenda

well im probably not welcome to post on here but here it is anyway this is the problem ive had with diatomite 100% this is what i sid in the otherpost but was continually said to be wrong shannon has had a similar problem with some bad diatomite i think im not sure of the problem exactly but mine is continually wet and moldy my willow leafs are doing the same and so does my privett if i water more than a few times a week this is what i was trying to say

gday dayne,

i know what your saying i get the same prob, as far as i can see it gets an algae on it, i dont beleive it to be of harm though, what i think is the cause of this is maybe not so much the diatomite, but the particle size, 2-7mm raise the water table in the pot more than anticipated, i beleive this is the cause of the algae which comes out because it is staying wet a bit to long, a mix of 5-8mm grit or similar to the mix i would beleive that it would be much better and a non issue.

possibly anyways

Jamie

Hey Guys
Thanks heaps for the replies and the Pictures KC.
If my tree was growing geat I would generally not be too concerned at all with the gunk on the surface. But when things aren't going right and I am learning here, I think everything needs to be considerd.
Got some more pictures to load and I want to go back over what has been siad

Oh and none of mine here are in Diatomite and are generally an organic grit mix to varying degrees.

Hey Brett,

I have been followng this thread since you posted it and while I dont have any ideas or suggestions regarding your problems a few things are standing out.

You say that it is a problem you had with a few trees and that only one privet was affected untill you pruned in mid summer. Do you disinfect your cuttings tools between trees as it sounds like a viral or fungal infection has entered the tree while pruning, spreading it from maybe one original source tree to many of your collection.

The other and this is something I am noticing with alot of growers, when potting no drainage layer of larger particles is used thereby creating a uniform mix thru out the pot. Anytime i pot anything up, be it in standard commercial potting mix or any other medium, no matter how shallow the pot I always try and include a layer of coarser material on the bottom to aid with drainage and air flow into the mix. I believe this is part of why the japanese always recommend layering from coarse to fine medium as you pot up.

Just a couple thoughts to ponder.

Matt

Edit: spelling

dayne wrote:well im probably not welcome to post on here but here it is anyway this is the problem ive had with diatomite 100% this is what i sid in the otherpost but was continually said to be wrong shannon has had a similar problem with some bad diatomite i think im not sure of the problem exactly but mine is continually wet and moldy my willow leafs are doing the same and so does my privett if i water more than a few times a week this is what i was trying to say

Hi dayne
As i mentioned, it is not only Diatomite with the problem, but Kanuma, a little on Akadama, (but not so much), and also Ray Nescis Commercial Organic mix.

Suspect it is something to do with moisture, as the trees with the problem are all Not in Full sun.

Ken

Many phytoplasma infected plants gain a bushy or witch's broom appearance due to changes in normal growth patterns caused by the infection. Most plants show apical dominance, but phytoplasma infection can cause the proliferation of auxiliary (side) shoots and an increase in size of the internodes.[8] Such symptoms are actually useful in the commercial production of poinsettia. The infection produces more axillary shoots, which enables production of poinsettia plants that have more than one flower.[9]

Phytoplasmas may cause many other symptoms that are induced because of the stress placed on the plant by infection rather than specific pathogenicity of the phytoplasma. Photosynthesis, especially photosystem II, is inhibited in many phytoplasma infected plants.[4] Phytoplasma infected plants often show yellowing which is caused by the breakdown of chlorophyll, whose biosynthesis is also inhibited.[4]

First up today was my Daughters little workshop Privet. I was very surprised to find a single curl grub in this one. I have never had that on a tree I keep on the bench before. if this was the only tree affected I would probably jump to the conclusion this caused the issue but It was the only one with a curl grub. After combing out it was not a great deal of roots for a privet but they look healthy. The soil surface definitely has a web structure to it but you would usually consider this benign or beneficial as it causes no obvious trouble to the base or roots. The roots and base where scrubbed vigorously with water and tooth brush
I made a coarse mix of various medium I had laying around and added a large amount of spag moss. Never tried this before but I reckon spag moss is magic stuff against pathogens/fungi and I have seen some about how good it is in root regeneration of sick trees. Some may be concerned about it holding too much water but from what I have seen that won't be a problem. After I soaked and drenched the tree in Kocide Blue Plus I Potted it into one of the colander pots I talked about recently I got a few years ago from the online orchid shop. Watered it in and gave in another drench with Kocide blue extra.
I reckon I have covered about all bases here. Very clean tree, open coarse mix, Fungicide and the healing properties of spag moss. Just gotta wait and see what happens.
Two more to go!

Next up was the first tree I posted.
Nothing suprising. Lots of nice root growth no lesions or afflictions.
Agian I scrubbed the roots and base then soaked, drenched in Kocide Blue Extra. I potted it up in the same mix as above but in a nursery pot. I also added a depth of scorio to the bottom to reduce the size of the pot while creating plenty of space to hopefully reduce the tree getting root bound. This was the other base coverd I should have mentioned in the above post. I did not root prune but they all have more space to grow.
Oh also removed as much of the affected shoots branches as possible without removing the growth that had returned to normal. (only on this one)

Last up is the one that although affected it has recovered the most and Tman noticed a water mark up the trunk.
I am happy to say that after a scrub the trunk looks totally normal and the scar on the bottom is not rotting and has started to heal. I will still keep a close eye on this though. Again I soaked drenched in kocide blue extra and repotted into a nursery pot with a depth of scorio. This time I used a more general mix of medium akadama and 15% spag moss.
Now I just have to wait and see. I might give a spray of Kocide Blue extra in the near future. If they are not showing improvement by say the end of the season I will threaten them with a bomb fire as was suggested
I have a little privet to collect soon so it will be interesting if it comes down with the same affliction.
Still going through the replies. Thanks!

download/file.php?id=24534&t=1

This plant shows a response to a hormonal imbalance, the small tight multiple branching with deformed leaves near the trunk is the main symptom.

it is caused by a few things, phytoplasma infections, genetic abnormality (witches broom's) .

or, ironically, mostly from,

Herbicide drift, particularly from dicamba or 2,4-D auxin type herbicides which are commonly found in such things as lawn sprays

https://utahpests.usu.edu/admin/images/u ... 20copy.jpg

Do you use Weed 'n' Feed, or something similar on your lawn?

https://www.yates.com.au/products/lawn-c ... d-hose-on/


Not trying to a clever dick or give you grief, your obviously very stressed about your trees.

Paul

this is what my willow leafs are doing exactly shooting hundreds of shoots from a couple of spots down low on the trunk

Dayne didn't leong have a fig with a branch doing that? He siad it hadn't happened to him in years and he had never worked out what caused it. I would post over on his site but I can't log in lately. I might be dropping into Leongs soon I should take one with me to see what he thinks.

Shannon wrote:Brett, thanks for the PM .
The condition does look similar to the first stage of the die back we experienced in the Bundaberg club a long time ago. After several years of training and styling tree's they would suddenly get distorted growth on branches and the branches would die back this would carry on till eventually the whole tree would die.
In the end we put it down to root rot and or letting tree's get overly root bound.
Majority of the privet that we had were collected from farming area's and in our inexperience and heist we trained and potted tree's without removing all of the original clay soil (bare rooting the tree's) we found this after removing all the roots on several dead or dieing tree's we found small pockets of clay and the surrounding roots/base, we also found privet (in the warmer climate) needed to be re-potted every year and occasional twice a year, the growth of the root systems were extreme and overly root bound trees lead to poor drainage also.

Hope this helps.

Trying to catch up on replies not much fun thinking about these
Thanks for that Shannon. It does sound very similar and I would have thought feasible. With what was surely a year of high fungus at least in my back yard maybe my trees and the ones you state where weakend to the point rampid Fungus attacked it.
One of mine was almost definitely at least full of roots when i cut it back before the issue. Other two not so much? They where all pretty clean of muck. Healthy roots and no sign of any decay under the soil.
But there definatly does sound some similarity.

I remember Matt sugesting that it was being transferd by the secetures.
This is definatly possible. I always thought as others are now trying to convince me what my problem is. That as long as the tree is well cared for the issue will go away.(I thought Australia doesn't have disease like those other countries that have to do that) So I have always been pretty cavilier with unwashed tools. Since this issue arose I have been teaching myself to be more diligant in cleaning tools between trees with metho.
The one thing that makes me consider that is not the only reason they are all affected. The time between cutting each tree was a month or two apart and I am sure I started washing tools inbetween but I could be wrong
Good point Matt. If anything this has taught me to be more carefull with the spread of disease.