AusBonsai

Hey fellow Bonsai enthusiasts, It has been my experience that a person who has been in Bonsai for a long time spends a lot of his/her time studying the faults of a tree and misses the overall effect or impact the tree initially has on you. I have made the mistake of looking at ,and liking a tree then start studying it and after studying it, walking away not liking it. After pulling myself up on this point I have decided that rules are rules but rules are made, and need to be, broken. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder? Anyway, maybe my artistic sensibility's need more time to mature.

There was an article that talked about a new innovation to view DVDs that took away a jumping of the picture. Now the article started by saying if you don't already see this when you watch movies you may be better of to stop reading here because you probably will after reading this.
This reminds me of your comment Bod.
You may be one that would rather not have this fault pointed out but I think If I was the one building those DVD's I would need it pointed out to me and also have a full understanding of it. So like wise if I am creating bonsai I would like to know the viewing faults and have a full understanding of them.
I remember my first mallsai from Big W and how I looked at it differently when the bar branches where pointed out to me. It took some value out of the tree for me but I would never want to go back to before it was pointed out to me.

Yep. very well put Bretts. Always nice to have an different interpretation put to me and understood it.

Pup wrote:Brett the first branch on the right breaks all the guidelines. It is a lot thinner that all the branches above it.
It comes out of the trunk less than one third the height. About 25mm not having a slide rule, is definitely not one third.

Which is, as is put a RULE branches start at one third and the lowest be thickest.

I just pointed out a nice tree breaking these applied rules. Not mine, I do not profess to be one of our top growers.

What I have observed is a lot of time is applied to these so called rules. Do not ever ignore them, but they will form part of your subconscious.
That is when you will understand them.

Understanding Bunjingi, is as the top Sensei, say is understanding Bonsai.
JMHO Pup

This is in relation to this tree. With this mudmap I made these claims

When I study this tree I see the bulk of the right branch as being slightly higher than 1/3 the height of the tree(as per pic). I have not got out a ruler but I believe even if you find the centre of the whole branch it is still not that much lower than 1/3 the height. Yet it is there. I figure the artist has extended the outer part of this pad to accentuate a change in height from the second branch. This gives the tree the basic triangle shape that is pleasing in this style and by keeping this lower part of the pad away from the trunk it also shows thought to showing trunk movement. I see all this as an artist using their understanding of the design principles to find a balance between bar branching and height of the first pad. Instead of bending the rules I see this as using the rules.

I still stand by the claims I made that it seems to me the artist with this tree has lowered the right branch to avoid bar branching but has done this in a manner that is not heavy or over bearing thus leaving us with an impression that the branch is not a bar branch and also not too low.
But I am a little disappointed that I did not elaborate on how I view the Rule:

First branch should be placed approximately one third the height of the tree.

And considering I was discussing this very rule with another member by PM I thought it would be a great place to re-visit this discussion.

This is a rule that was stated to me as ,strictly as it is written, so why are there so many great bonsai with first branches lower and higher than 1/3?
After some consideration I came to the conclusion that like the 1:6 rule the 1/3 first branch rule should be a starting point or average. We look at the average bonsai and it has a first branch at about 1/3. This represents a healthy tree of mature age. An average tree.
It is no wonder the rules get such a bad rap when such a rule is taken so literally. We see many bonsai with the first branch higher than 1/3 I think we can basically say in trees this would be from harsh conditions or maybe searching for light.
What is less discussed is why would a tree have a branch lower than 1/3. To me I figured a bonsai with branches lower than 1/3 represented a very healthy tree that has never wanted for anything. A very full vibrant tree. It has never suffered disease, drought, fire or anything that may cause it to give up on lower branches. It sits on it's own with light, water and nutrients a plenty so it is a very full tree.
So again it is all how it fits into the story. If you have a low branch then it is usually a very full and vibrant tree. A bonsai that has no low branches tells a story of harder times.

Since we last discussed this we had another big discussion on whether rules should be broken that some may find intresting.
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=2354&start=75&hilit

Hi guys,

I was reading this topic today and found it important to remind myself of some of the guidelines for designing bonsai. I thought that this may be useful to bump so that new bonsai enthusiasts can understand how they may like to develop their plans.

During the read I noted that there was discussion about trunk size proportion to height, and branch placement. However, I didn't see anything about trunk movement. Considering I have posted pics of some of my plants recently and received advice that the trunk lacked movement, I was hoping some of the learned members of the community may share their insight on how we may wish to develop movement within the trunk, and what constitutes desirable or undesirable movement.

Cheers,
Damo