AusBonsai

Has anyone here successfully sown JBP from seeds here in Australia? If you have, please share your experiences
I just bought some JBP seeds online and want to start them out. The instructions that came with the package was very brief:
Soak in water for 24hrs
Cold stratify for 30 days
Sow 1/8" and keep warm.
I'm sure there are more to it such as: choosing the right time, right soil, fungus protection... even the right way to soak and cold stratifying....
Please help!

Ask shibui or grant!

Hi Kvan,
JBP germinates easily. I do not find any need to soak or stratify here and Melbourne growers have found the same. I just sow the seeds in seed trays and keep them damp. Seedlings emerge as soon as the weather warms up in spring.
Initially I assumed they required stratification so sowed seed in winter and left trays out in the frost over winter however seed sowed later in spring germinates in just a week or 2 without treatment.
Stratifying - sow seed and leave pots in the open over winter (cold areas) or mix seed with damp peat, sand or sawdust in aplastic bag and store in the fridge for 3-5 weeks or sometimes in the freezer for a week or 2. I find JBP does not need stratification.
At the risk of causing uproar I do not believe JBP needs fungus to grow. This only helps feed the tree in poor soils. Feed them and they will grow well. I do not introduce fungus into the seed trays or when potting seedlings up. I do find that the root fungus gets into the pots by itself, usually in the first year. again, if you are worried, add some soil from an established tree to innoculate the soil mix. It probably won't hurt.
Soil mix is the same for all seedlings. Start with a seed raising mix as it is sterile so gives the seedlings the best chance. When you have more experience you can often get away with normal potting soil for easy to germinate species (JBP is easy)
If you want to soak seed before sowing just put them in a container and cover with water - no mystery here. Following day pour off the water and sow seed. nb Wet seed is hard to handle - they stick to each other and to fingers etc making it difficult to sow evenly. I have never soaked JBP seed before sowing.

In short:
Sow anytime but germination in early spring will give more time to grow in the first year.
No need to stratify but if you are concerned, leave trays out over winter or stratify in the fridge - it will not hurt.

Sow seed as for any other species and watch them grow.

Where did the seed come from? I think JBP seed is AQUIS prohibited import now without phytosanitary certificates??? illegal imports is how we get diseases like dothostroma in pines.

i just started up a heep of black and red, chucked them in the fridge in some just damp diatomite for a month or two then just put them in seed trays with straight diatomite already most have popped up with a few straglers, being the end of autumn when i did it i was unsure what would happen. i figured it would be warm enough for them to pop up before winter then come spring they could just begin growing, has worked well so far.

Great stuff Jarryd
I am not sure if you caught my reference out of my Propagating book in another query on this but it stated that Autumn sown seedlings where of a better quality. This was after stating that as Shibui mentioned Stratification is not needed so I gather they mean what you have done. In I mean they where not sown in Autumn for germination in spring.
There has been much talk on the forums whether JBP needs stratification. My book states that cold stratification reduced the variability of germination but not really the percentage.
In other words the nurseries cold stratify so that the seeds all come up at the same time but it is not necessary!

yeh brett the info you gave me was great mate i will see if i can link that thread to this one. still have the white pine seeds in the fridge, unsure how they will go up here probably to hot but i am planing on keeping them as shohin and using an old fridge over winter to provide cold period

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4005

Just wondering where you sourced these seeds from? If you happened to buy them from overseas via eBay etc. you will unfortunately most likely recieve a letter from customs informing you that they have been confiscated, I have heard of it happening of a couple of occasions!

No customs letter for my JBP seeds HAHA, This has been very helpful, Thanks guys.
I am just making some for shohin, What can they carry from the states?.

The importation of Pinus spp. seed and nursery stock (excluding tissue cultures) from Haiti, Honduras, Iraq, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Philippines, South Africa, Spain, Tanzania and the United States of America

Seed and nursery stock (excluding tissue cultures) have been assessed as posing a serious disease risk (Pitch canker). Entry is prohibited by legislation from the above mentioned countries.

Bad stuff!

Bretts wrote:

The importation of Pinus spp. seed and nursery stock (excluding tissue cultures) from Haiti, Honduras, Iraq, Italy, Japan, Mexico, Philippines, South Africa, Spain, Tanzania and the United States of America

Seed and nursery stock (excluding tissue cultures) have been assessed as posing a serious disease risk (Pitch canker). Entry is prohibited by legislation from the above mentioned countries.

Bad stuff!

Does it mean that it's OK to import from other countries not included on the list e.g. Japan and UK?

Good question Kvan
I remember asking aqis this same question and the deal is if something is not listed it has not been risk assessed and is not allowed in. If something is not listed you need to fill in a request risk assessment form. I never did this but I believe it is a free service.

This link is in our collecting and importing forum. You will find there are many things we can bring in but also many things we can't.
http://www.aqis.gov.au/icon32/asp/ex_querycontent.asp

Many things such as carpinus seeds of non-commercial quantities need no special documentation and are as simple as posting them in. I recently had 1000 carpinus seeds in from Europe and it was the first time they where inspected by aqis.

The only reason we even have sueji elm in Australia is because a lady snuck in a piece for cutting in her bra but it is important to remember every year there are more and more diseases that make it into Australia because people bring stuff in illegal. Consider how lucky we are in Australia

Dutch Elm Disease was first noticed in France in 1918 and identified in Holland in 1922 - hence its name. In the 1980s it killed 90% of England's elms and 50% of Europe's elms. Elm leaf beetle is a pest on the trees, defoliating and depleting the trees' vigour, but it does not spread Dutch Elm Disease. It's the elm bark beetle that does this, by spreading Dutch Elm Disease fungus spores onto the trees and into the soil. Both these beetles are in Australia but as yet Dutch Elm Disease is not. As a result, Australia has some of the best stands of elm trees left in the world.

We have lots of JBP in Australia you would be better served searching them out and organising the collection of the seed locally.
What about the Chinese gardens in Sydney harbour. Is anyone collecting seeds from those trees. Maybe contact Phillipe out there.

I see that introduced diseases from imported seeds and trees can be horrible. Otherwise importing pines like these would be cheap?
http://www.beijingbonsai.com/appreciati ... -1497.html

The trouble is we do not know what pests/ diseases could be imported until it happens or what the consequences. Recent detection of a myrtle petal disease in Sydney - as a fungal disease has probably already spread too far to be contained/ eradicated. Some concern that many of our natives are members of Myrtacea family and nobody knows if or how it will affect them.
Bretts is right - lots of Black pines already in Aus why risk importing problems. My new JBP seed tree has yielded its first crop this year though my older seed trees were all lost when the fires burnt out the (previous) property in 2009.
Great to see other members posting for availability of seed /propagating material rather than racing to the internet to import.