If I could turn back time…

[JimmyTheSkip]

[image] https://media.giphy.com/media/3ohze26ae ... /giphy.gif[/image]

I know you all thought of Cher when you saw the title, it’s ok to admit it… Moving on.

If you could turn back time and give yourself 3 pieces of advice when you first started, knowing what you know now, what would it be?

I was always taught that it’s better to learn from others mistakes and as a beginner I feel like I’m probably doing things wrong and won’t have a clue that I’m doing it wrong until the mistakes have been made. Hopefully this thread can stop that.

[TimS]

Hmmm just 3 pieces of advice for my younger bonsai self. So i never struggled with the keeping them alive aspect of bonsai, so mine lean more to improving development.

1. Young material might be cheap to buy, but limits learning and development. It is worth buying more advanced/ rough material to learn more advanced techniques on *caveat being you should be confident in keeping trees alive before rushing out to spend big $$$ on stock*.

2. Join a club, don't just sit in your back garden and do it yourself. While there are umpteen videos on youtube, nothing beats direct guidance of someone experienced there to guide you. Just be aware all who claim to be experienced are not necessarily so.

3. Don't feel compelled to grow every single species you see a photo of a good bonsai tree of. Learn what species you are good with, focus on those predominantly and maybe play with the odd different species here and there. Rather than have 50+ different versions of sticks in pots because you once saw one in the Kokufu.

Oh and as a bonus: Tim yes you should have purchased a hell of a lot more high-quality trees about 5 years ago before prices went stratospheric

[JimmyTheSkip]

Thanks TimS, appreciate the response. I think I’ve got enough random trees in pots from nursery stock and am planning on going to my local club meeting in Feb. where they’re doing a workshop. I’m thinking I should go out to a bonsai nursery and spend a little more on stock that is ready to have its first styling, that’s been grown with the goal of getting turned into a bonsai.

I think the idea of restricting myself to a couple of different types of trees is a good one too. Learn to care and grow them well, rather than just going and having 10 different species of tree.

[TimS]

Thanks TimS, appreciate the response. I think I’ve got enough random trees in pots from nursery stock and am planning on going to my local club meeting in Feb. where they’re doing a workshop. I’m thinking I should go out to a bonsai nursery and spend a little more on stock that is ready to have its first styling, that’s been grown with the goal of getting turned into a bonsai.

I think the idea of restricting myself to a couple of different types of trees is a good one too. Learn to care and grow them well, rather than just going and having 10 different species of tree.

It's probably worth trying a good range of species initially to see what works for you before narrowing your growing down. There will be species you love but don't do well in your climate, those you dislike but do great in your climate, and if you're lucky you'll find some that you both like and grow well in your climate.

For example, these days I'm focusing primarily on Maple, Ginkgo and Pine. I tried Prunus expecting it to be the third 'cornerstone' species i would focus on as i love them, but it's one i just don't have the knack for. Pines I've grown to love having initially found them a bit boring.

No need to rush it, take some time trying out different species, but i can say that it's far more rewarding growing trees that progress well and quickly compared to trying to persuade unhappy trees to grow well.

[SuperBonSaiyan]

Health of the tree is most important. Get it healthy above (foliage) and below (roots) before doing any major work.

Look at lots of trees and think about them. Why do you like (or dislike) it? What pot is it in? Does anything look odd or contrived? What might you change?

Don't buy a Shindeshojo with the intention of air layering it.

Don't repot out of season.

(I'm still learning this one) Water appropriately.

[Promethius]

I wouldn't turn back time - I think any improvements I've made are due to previous mistakes. I've only been serious for 2-3 years, but have had a collection in some form for 6-7 years.

- Growing from a seed or cheap pre-bonsai stock is rewarding, but only in the long term. I went through a phase of accumulating a lot of stock that won't be anything special for at least a decade.

- I didn't learn my microclimate. I overwatered and killed things. My backyard is quite enclosed with high fences - even when there's >6h sun/day and temperatures over 30 in summer, the lack of wind keeps soil wet.

- Old trees aren't young trees. I got used to sound trees' ability to bounce back from hard root and limb pruning, and killed two nice trees. Haven't forgiven myself for one of those.

Andy


EDIT - oh, big one: I misspelled my username when I joined!

[JimmyTheSkip]

EDIT - oh, big one: I misspelled my username when I joined!

That is gold! Isn't there a way to get it changed?

[DaveZ]

I developed an interest in bonsai sometime around the mid nineties, grew a few trees from seed and started to style them around 2000. I then had a major career change and moved towns. I didn't continue with the trees, and for some reason I never came back to it until 2020 or 21.

The first piece of advise I would give myself would be to not let life get in the way and keep growing trees. Imagine the trees I could have with an extra 20 years of growing time and styling experience.

Number 2 would be to be objective when I look at my work. See the flaws and look for ways the tree could be better. Be realistic in what you're looking at. Fortunately this seems to come fairly naturally to me, so I can see when something doesn't look right and I can keep working on it until it does.

Number 3, and one I keep having to tell myself, don't forget to fertilise!

[Promethius]

That is gold! Isn't there a way to get it changed?

Not at the moment. Our primary forum administrator / moderator hasn’t been able to attend to these things for a little while.

The forever-typo curbs my hubris (an act of hubris, ironically, being Prometheus’ defining moment).

[Rory]

3 points of advice is not enough....

1. Allow your trees to grow a lot and maintain good health before you work them. DO NOT constantly cut them back. Do not cut back or work trees, or cut roots on trees that are not bushy and healthy.

2. Only water trees when they start to get somewhat dryish. Do not have a watering routine that is the same every day. You need to check each tree to see whether it needs rewatering. If you have been watering correctly, then you can afford to overwater in preparation of a hot and windy day, or with a water sprinkler when you are on holidays. Overall, do not have a mix that is constantly sitting in wet conditions. Very few trees like to be in constant water.

3. Wiring isn't neccesary. Its expensive, tiresome, and can be detrimental on the branching if you allow it to stay on too long. You can get beautiful movement from clip-and-grow (just cutting back the new growth hard each year to influence the tree as to how you want it to grow) and you can use anchoring to move heavy branches if you want them repositioned.

4. You don't need to remove a massive amount of root when you first do rootwork on a purchase. Just focus on separating the roots, and making sure the roots aren't a tangled mess. If you keep the root removal to a minimum, and leave large root removals till a year from then, it will be more beneficial to the health of the tree going forward.

5. Defoliation should not be part of a routine procedure. I feel it should only be used to promote backing-budding or in some ways, for leaf reduction on advanced material. But it severely affects the health of the tree, as it now needs to send out an entire flush of new growth. If the entire new flush is then attacked by pests, the health declines rapidly as a result of needing another entire flush of growth. If the tree is healthy, this may not be a problem, but you can badly affect a tree from doing this if the tree isn't in great health or used to doing this. Also, the timing of doing this can be disastrous with natives if its done prior to winter before the new growth has had time to harden off.

6. Get full sun. Make it happen. Most trees love a days sun. You can always build shade for trees, but its too hard to try and 'find more sun'.

7. Use slow-release fertilizer. That way you usually have time to see if something has gone wrong in your application.

8. Routinely check for pests and caterpillars and borers, particularly on material that is overgrown. They can quickly decimate a large branch if left unchecked.

9. Style. Style your trees to however you love them. Traditional bonsai or natural is all a preference. But don't immediately remove branches until you've spent a long, long, long time contemplating whether it would be more beautiful to leave the branches on, and make it look more interesting over time.
But the most significant thing with style is to make your decisions early. Once the branches harden off, it can become impossible to move them later on.

10. When buying new material....If nursery material is loose in the pot, it might be best to avoid this as its either just been potted, or it may have root issues. When you buy nursery material, check the root spread by putting your finger deep into the mix. If you can't get your finger into the mix because its too compact, then avoid it.
Make sure the material has a lot of branching down low to work with and gives you a lot of options. Don't buy a tree simply because its a species you wanted to grow. Choose material that is suited for bonsai. Too many times I've purchased material simply because it was a species I wanted, when I had found a much more beautiful tree in the same species later on and then discarded my earlier purchase. But I find it hard to follow this rule, as I still purchase skinny sticks if its a really desired species that I've wanted for many years.

11. If you haven't got space between your trees, you have too many. They need space for optimum health and sun exposure.

[Mickeyjaytee]

I would say the ONE thing I would change was to not waste so much money on plants/trees not suited to my climate. Can you grow some of them? Yes, but the work and unhealthy look of them just isn’t worth it. Local plants and a few exotic exceptions is the way to go imo

[JimmyTheSkip]

1. Allow your trees to grow a lot and maintain good health before you work them. DO NOT constantly cut them back. Do not cut back or work trees, or cut roots on trees that are not bushy and healthy.

I think this is a hard one for all beginners. I know with me, the first thing I think about when I get a plant home is how can I turn this into a bonsai, and then I proceed to take out my pruning tools and start cutting. Then after I look at it and think, hmmm I should've probably left that on...

2. Only water trees when they start to get somewhat dryish. Do not have a watering routine that is the same every day. You need to check each tree to see whether it needs rewatering. If you have been watering correctly, then you can afford to overwater in preparation of a hot and windy day, or with a water sprinkler when you are on holidays. Overall, do not have a mix that is constantly sitting in wet conditions. Very few trees like to be in constant water.

Guilty again. Only today was I thinking to myself, I think I'm watering too much, the soil is still damp and I'm thinking about watering it again because I don't want them to die. Not realising that actually I'm probably over watering.

3. Wiring isn't neccesary. Its expensive, tiresome, and can be detrimental on the branching if you allow it to stay on too long. You can get beautiful movement from clip-and-grow (just cutting back the new growth hard each year to influence the tree as to how you want it to grow) and you can use anchoring to move heavy branches if you want them repositioned.

Not guilty of this one. I'm terrible at wiring. I should practice on all the trunks that I've chopped off and thrown away. I think as a beginner you just want to get proficient. It comes from a good place but you're right, we probably aren't even doing it at the right time half the time. We just get a new tree and want to do things.

4. You don't need to remove a massive amount of root when you first do rootwork on a purchase. Just focus on separating the roots, and making sure the roots aren't a tangled mess. If you keep the root removal to a minimum, and leave large root removals till a year from then, it will be more beneficial to the health of the tree going forward.

You're killing me here. I get a pot home and immediately take it out of the nursery pot, and cut off half the root base. I was listening to the Bonsai Stuff podcast today and he was saying he buys a tree and then will just make sure that it is healthy before he does anything. Doesn't repot it, doesn't root prune, just observes the tree. I need to get better at that.

5. Defoliation should not be part of a routine procedure. I feel it should only be used to promote backing-budding or in some ways, for leaf reduction on advanced material. But it severely affects the health of the tree, as it now needs to send out an entire flush of new growth. If the entire new flush is then attacked by pests, the health declines rapidly as a result of needing another entire flush of growth. If the tree is healthy, this may not be a problem, but you can badly affect a tree from doing this if the tree isn't in great health or used to doing this. Also, the timing of doing this can be disastrous with natives if its done prior to winter before the new growth has had time to harden off.

I don't know enough about defoliation to even know when the right time of year is to do it. I feel like it isn't something beginners need to worry about but maybe I'm wrong there.

6. Get full sun. Make it happen. Most trees love a days sun. You can always build shade for trees, but its too hard to try and 'find more sun'.

Interesting that you would say that, I seem to always be worried that the maple leaves are going to get burnt.

7. Use slow-release fertilizer. That way you usually have time to see if something has gone wrong in your application.

8. Routinely check for pests and caterpillars and borers, particularly on material that is overgrown. They can quickly decimate a large branch if left unchecked.

I feel like I'm good with the checking for pests and the like, but I do need to improve on my fertilizer knowledge. When and how much. I've been looking into the teabag method, again listening to the Bonsai Stuff podcast got me thinking about it.

9. Style. Style your trees to however you love them. Traditional bonsai or natural is all a preference. But don't immediately remove branches until you've spent a long, long, long time contemplating whether it would be more beautiful to leave the branches on, and make it look more interesting over time.
But the most significant thing with style is to make your decisions early. Once the branches harden off, it can become impossible to move them later on.

It is difficult keeping up with all the different styles and the rules of those styles, I like the idea of being able to design a tree that I like, rather than what all the rules say you should do.

10. When buying new material....If nursery material is loose in the pot, it might be best to avoid this as its either just been potted, or it may have root issues. When you buy nursery material, check the root spread by putting your finger deep into the mix. If you can't get your finger into the mix because its too compact, then avoid it.
Make sure the material has a lot of branching down low to work with and gives you a lot of options. Don't buy a tree simply because its a species you wanted to grow. Choose material that is suited for bonsai. Too many times I've purchased material simply because it was a species I wanted, when I had found a much more beautiful tree in the same species later on and then discarded my earlier purchase. But I find it hard to follow this rule, as I still purchase skinny sticks if its a really desired species that I've wanted for many years.

I think we've all been guilty of buying a tree because it's a species we want to grow, and overlooking all the issues the tree has. I think part of it, at least for me, is the idea that it doesn't matter because I'm just learning so I might as well get any tree and learn the basics.

11. If you haven't got space between your trees, you have too many. They need space for optimum health and sun exposure.

I definitely have space but I get what you are saying. It goes back to the health of the tree. If we want good bonsai, it has to be healthy.

Thanks very much for posting! It made me think a lot.

[DaveZ]

7. Use slow-release fertilizer. That way you usually have time to see if something has gone wrong in your application.

8. Routinely check for pests and caterpillars and borers, particularly on material that is overgrown. They can quickly decimate a large branch if left unchecked.

I feel like I'm good with the checking for pests and the like, but I do need to improve on my fertilizer knowledge. When and how much. I've been looking into the teabag method, again listening to the Bonsai Stuff podcast got me thinking about it.

I bought a heap of cotton tea bags about a year ago after listening to the same podcast. I have the dynamic lifter and blood and bone to put in them, but do you think I've actually got off my butt and done it? Nope

9. Style. Style your trees to however you love them. Traditional bonsai or natural is all a preference. But don't immediately remove branches until you've spent a long, long, long time contemplating whether it would be more beautiful to leave the branches on, and make it look more interesting over time.
But the most significant thing with style is to make your decisions early. Once the branches harden off, it can become impossible to move them later on.

It is difficult keeping up with all the different styles and the rules of those styles, I like the idea of being able to design a tree that I like, rather than what all the rules say you should do.

The rules are only really there to provide an avenue to create a pleasing looking tree. Like a recipe for a cake. Doesn't mean you can't fiddle with the recipe to suit your own taste. You might create a masterpiece, you might create rubbish, whereas the recipe gives you assurance of results. Just do you, but remain objective when reviewing your work, and spend plenty of time studying good trees and compare, you'll learn a lot as you go through the motions as long as you're realistic when evaluating your trees.

Cheers,
Dave.

[Nate.bonsai]

Only buy the amount of trees that you have the time for.

There’s no point having fifty unattended, unloved trees littering your backyard that aren’t really developing (other than through neglect). Better to have seven that actually get trimmed, repotted, shaped, watered etc. properly. Your collection will actually advance in quality rather than just quantity.

The time that they take will depend on what stage they’re at. Baby trees are just sticks in a pot and probably need more growing and less fiddling. Trees that have progressed and are in development probably need the most work. Very mature and refined trees probably just need maintenance techniques (although the number of branches to attend to can be time-consuming).


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[JimmyTheSkip]

I bought a heap of cotton tea bags about a year ago after listening to the same podcast. I have the dynamic lifter and blood and bone to put in them, but do you think I've actually got off my butt and done it? Nope

I think we are all guilty of this at times.

The time that they take will depend on what stage they’re at. Baby trees are just sticks in a pot and probably need more growing and less fiddling. Trees that have progressed and are in development probably need the most work. Very mature and refined trees probably just need maintenance techniques (although the number of branches to attend to can be time-consuming).

I think I’m learning this. I have got a few young trees but I don’t really have anything that have progressed and are in development, definitely need to get some so that I am learning bonsai. At the moment with the young trees I feel like it will be a long waiting game. After listening to another episode of Bonsai Stuff today about natives I was considering getting a few more mature ones and seeing how I go with them.