radical approach to an ugly Cedar.

[Dario]

Hey Andrew, that is looking good!
I am pleased that your cedar pulled through and hope it does just as well after the recent repot.
Yeah it sure is pushing some new growth!
Thanks for updating
Cheers, Dario.

[Andrew Legg]

Do you get a better bend that way???

Presumably, yes but i found that it did not hold as well as i thought. Cedars take a long time to set and the wire helps hold it in place. It also is supposed to hold the tree together better for radical compression. I have to admit though that i did it just to see what would happen. I did find that i could do almost any sort of bending and the tree did not come apart or lose its position.

Josh,

I'll 2nd what Bodhi has said. I'll also add to it a bit. When one needs to bend a heavy branch (or trunk) on a tree, there are numerous ways of doing it, but they all boil down to one fact. How much "spring" or tension is in the wood versus how much hold there is in the bending mechanism. There are a number of ways to get the "hold" greater than the "spring". These are (and I'll probably miss a few here):

External
1.) Loads of wire
2.) Guy wires
3.) Fulcrums to bend around
4.) External supports and braces

Internal
5.) Cutting slices from the structure at the bending point
6.) Drilling holes into the point at which the bend is needed
7.) Removing strips of heartwood where the bend is needed

So, with my cedar I chose the last method for three reasons and they are:

1.) I wanted continuous bends (ruled out 5 & 6)
2.) Cedars take ages to set in place and to avoid wire bite, that in my mind ruled out 1,3 & 4
3.) I wanted to try technique #7

So there you go. The added advantage to me for #7 was that once the tree had started to set, I can remove the external wiring to avoid wire bite, which I did yesterday, and still have the internal wires holding the trunk in shape until it has completely set. There is unfortunately still some serious bite up near the top of the tree. Bit bummed out that I missed that! Once the tree has settled into it's new home, I may rewire the trunk and give it another tweak just to compact it some more. It also needs planting at a different angle to get the correct effect I was looking for. That's another day's problem though!

Hope that helps, and if anyone wants to add to my explanation, go for it!

Cheers,

Andrew

[GavinG]

Nice shaping in the branches as well, they complement the trunk.

Gavin

[kcpoole]

Nice follow up Bodhi and Andrew, good to hear they both have servived the ordeal, and totally agree that you can get a far greater bend with the wire inside the trunk like this.
My Radiata in the thread I linked earlier is going well too . Will be another year before I can do anything too it yet.

Ken

[bodhidharma]

O.K..have banged on enough about posting this up, here tis". The tree has a head now and i will let it grow freely for a while before stage 2 begins. It is healthy and enjoying its larger pot and i will have a look underneath the wrapping next Winter.IT LOOKS LIKE WE ARE STILL EXPERIENCING DIFFERENT PHOTOS COMING UP. CLICK AND THEY ARE UNDERNEATH. WIERD

[GavinG]

Works for me Bodhi, both tree and photos. They can be slow to thicken, but the shape is very promising. Keep 'em coming.

(Feel like starting another argument Bodhi?) (wicked cackle)

Gavin

[bodhidharma]

(Feel like starting another argument Bodhi?) (wicked cackle)

Naawww..I read your input with great interest and you would be all over me in a good argument

[Guy]

in the initial post photo even though it had a lack of movement and taper I saw potential as elegant bunjin----could you tell me what made this 'Ugly" to you-was it the branch placement-was the movement and taper problem too hard to fix--can these develop taper over time--Just wondering what caused such a radical change of plan

[GavinG]

Talk's easy, Bodhi, your trees are certainly convincing.

Are you mobile soon?

Gavin

[bodhidharma]

-could you tell me what made this 'Ugly" to you-was it the branch placement-was the movement and taper problem too hard to fix--can these develop taper over time

G'day Guy,
the tree could have been developed as it was but, lets face it, there is a million stock standard Literati in Australia's backyard and i have quite a few of them. The tree, in my opinion, did not have the potential to be something of interest and sat on my shelf for sale at $100 for a very long time. When they do not move it indicates to me that it has no appeal to Bonsai people so change is imperative. I might have misrepresented it calling it ugly but nursing a tree, that i know has no future, starts to become a burden and ugly to me.

[bodhidharma]

Are you mobile soon?

I am mobile and practising my Martial Art at a furious pace Gavin. My trees rejoice that i am no longer limping toward them.

[Qitianlong]

which martial art do you train in Bodhidharma?

[Guy]

-could you tell me what made this 'Ugly" to you-was it the branch placement-was the movement and taper problem too hard to fix--can these develop taper over time

G'day Guy,
the tree could have been developed as it was but, lets face it, there is a million stock standard Literati in Australia's backyard and i have quite a few of them. The tree, in my opinion, did not have the potential to be something of interest and sat on my shelf for sale at $100 for a very long time. When they do not move it indicates to me that it has no appeal to Bonsai people so change is imperative. I might have misrepresented it calling it ugly but nursing a tree, that i know has no future, starts to become a burden and ugly to me.

I can dig that-- ----just wondering cos I personally don't have any literati at the moment and don't know of any around here .so it's 'bout time I had a go at a couple

[Josh]

What a fantastic post. Thankyou all for taking the time to fill in the details on how this process works. Thinking I might go look at a few of my trees now. I do have a collected callistemon that I might try having a go with bending the trunk this way, anyone tried it yet I was thinking of shortening the trunk so if it breaks it won't be a problem.

Josh

[Boics]

Be very careful with the callistemon josh.
Larger branches will crack and splinter very easily.