Seeking thoughts on rocks/stones in bonsai, not root over rock.
Aesthetically or sentimentally can be too much to add a rock and what about the line between bonsai and penjing how is that drawn?
Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
-
Amanda
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 586
- Joined: April 10th, 2010, 2:57 pm
- Favorite Species: [color=#008040]Ficus & Natives[/color]
- Bonsai Age: 0
- Bonsai Club: [color=#FF00BF]AUSBONSAI.COM[/color] [color=#00BF00]۩[/color]
Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
Failure and disappointment is part of the learning process. ~ Paul (pjkatich)
-
Mitchell
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 1807
- Joined: February 15th, 2010, 4:34 pm
- Favorite Species: Ficus
- Bonsai Age: 1
- Bonsai Club: [color=#FFFF00]Aus[/color][color=#40FF40]Bonsai[/color]
- Location: Sydney,Beecroft
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
Funny you mention that literally moments before seeing your post, I was considering posting my collection of stones for said purposes. 
Some come close to individual display quality, yet most merely fall into the scenery area.
I'll be interested to see, this thread play out.
How do we judge how much is too much?
How much presence does a rock have to a display, how do you judge if the rock over powers your tree?
Some come close to individual display quality, yet most merely fall into the scenery area. I'll be interested to see, this thread play out.
How do we judge how much is too much?
How much presence does a rock have to a display, how do you judge if the rock over powers your tree?
Last edited by Mitchell on May 18th, 2010, 8:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Regards, Mitchell.
"It is one thing to shape a tree into form, but when you are able to convincingly deceive ones perception of reality, something much more is accomplished than just a simple bonsai."
"In a perfect world, we would all be giants and all plants Bonsai."
"Grow big, finish small."
Join Ausbonsai today Click Here!
"It is one thing to shape a tree into form, but when you are able to convincingly deceive ones perception of reality, something much more is accomplished than just a simple bonsai."
"In a perfect world, we would all be giants and all plants Bonsai."
"Grow big, finish small."
Join Ausbonsai today Click Here! -
63pmp
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 492
- Joined: December 20th, 2008, 7:41 pm
- Bonsai Age: 25
- Location: rural NSW
- Been thanked: 2 times
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
People have used rocks and stones to hide defects, such as no roots on one side of the tree; to counter an unbalanced tree design. Other than that not really any need for a stone, a tree should stand on its own. IMHO.
Paul
Paul
"The older I get, the less I know"
-
Amanda
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 586
- Joined: April 10th, 2010, 2:57 pm
- Favorite Species: [color=#008040]Ficus & Natives[/color]
- Bonsai Age: 0
- Bonsai Club: [color=#FF00BF]AUSBONSAI.COM[/color] [color=#00BF00]۩[/color]
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
Any photo examples of harmonious (or not 
)stone/tree/pot combinations would be fantastic.
)stone/tree/pot combinations would be fantastic.Failure and disappointment is part of the learning process. ~ Paul (pjkatich)
-
Gerard
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 2656
- Joined: October 7th, 2009, 12:32 pm
- Favorite Species: pines
- Bonsai Age: 16
- Bonsai Club: BSV, Northwest, Northern Suburbs, VNBC
- Location: Melbourne
- Has thanked: 18 times
- Been thanked: 49 times
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
I have seen stones used cleverly to hide defects. Another use especially in penjing is to depict the terrain in which the tree grows. In bonsai a tree such as a mugho (swiss mountain pine) might have small rocks above and below the soil to depict mountainous terrain.
Gerard
Gerard
Q: Why are we all here?
A: Because we are not all there.
A: Because we are not all there.
-
shibui
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 7933
- Joined: August 22nd, 2009, 8:41 pm
- Favorite Species: trident maple
- Bonsai Age: 41
- Bonsai Club: Albury/Wodonga; BSV; Canberra; VNBC
- Location: Yackandandah
- Has thanked: 81 times
- Been thanked: 1627 times
- Contact:
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
The late Tom Yamamoto who visited Aust for workshops and demos during the 1980s was quite scathing about using rocks with bonsai. In his opinion, with the exception of root over rock and root on rock styles, only saikei should have rocks. In his opinion if the setting had rocks it became a landscape ie saikei rather than bonsai. He was adamant that a bonsai should be able to stand by itself. If a bonsai needs a rock to correct a defect it was not worthy of bonsai status. I tend to agree with his ideas - Most of the attempts I have seen to improve a tree with a defective nebari by shoving a rock in have looked artificial and in my opinion, have not improved the tree. There are many ways to rectify defects in atree. They may take longer than shoving in a rock but usually end up improving the tree much more.
I really love root over rock style bonsai and i have grown saikei (tray landscapes) but I would rather spend time restyling an unbalanced tree or rectifying a defective nebari rather than opting for the quick 'shove a rock' in fix.
Look forward to seeing anyone who can show where adding a rock was the best option for improving a tree however maybe we are just be talking about different branches of the art - Bonsai, Saikei and Penjing - all have different standards and definitions.
look forward to other opinions.
I really love root over rock style bonsai and i have grown saikei (tray landscapes) but I would rather spend time restyling an unbalanced tree or rectifying a defective nebari rather than opting for the quick 'shove a rock' in fix.
Look forward to seeing anyone who can show where adding a rock was the best option for improving a tree however maybe we are just be talking about different branches of the art - Bonsai, Saikei and Penjing - all have different standards and definitions.
look forward to other opinions.
http://shibuibonsai.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
-
MattA
- Banned
- Posts: 3112
- Joined: February 13th, 2010, 2:37 pm
- Favorite Species: Lichen
- Bonsai Age: 26
- Bonsai Club: Killing Trees Inc..
- Location: Lower Hunter Valley
- Been thanked: 2 times
- Contact:
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
42 Mice ~Imperfection
"Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards." ~ Vernon Sanders Law
"All the knowledge I possess everyone else can acquire, but my heart is all my own." ~ Johann Wolfgang Von Goeth
"Bonsai becomes great when growers start trees they know they will never see in a pot"
"Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards." ~ Vernon Sanders Law
"All the knowledge I possess everyone else can acquire, but my heart is all my own." ~ Johann Wolfgang Von Goeth
"Bonsai becomes great when growers start trees they know they will never see in a pot"
-
craigw60
- Aussie Bonsai Fan
- Posts: 1904
- Joined: January 12th, 2010, 12:02 pm
- Favorite Species: many
- Bonsai Age: 25
- Bonsai Club: yarra valley
- Location: vic
- Been thanked: 1 time
Re: Rocks or Stones in Bonsai
I am 100% with Shibui. If you have a tree with defective roots then fix the problem or discard the tree but to stick a rock in it solves nothing. I have yet to see a convincing example of this technique. To make a good saikei takes considerable skill and you need to decide very early if you want to emphasize the rocks or the trees. Like Shibui I think the best use of rocks is to use them in the root over rock style which if properly done is superb.
Craig
Craig
