Radermachera Sinica ( china doll)

[Greenhorn]

not sure if this is in the right place or not but this plant was a self sown seed quite a few years ago and was left in the same pot and hasn't been touched since. i think it has potential as a nice bonsai but i don't know which is why i am asking here. any suggestions

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[Greth]

I dont know what these guys are like at back budding, but you have a bit of a 'boring' problem with that low part of the trunk. If you are in the mood to try something wildly, and dont care too much if you kill it, give it a severe chop.
More careful experiments would be
A} pinching out the tips and seeing where backbudding occurs, if it does.
B) Airlayer off the top part, which looks quite interesting, and in the process you shorten the boring trunk and hopefully encourage the base to do more. I like this approach, you get two plants out of it.
C} get some wire onto that low trunk and put some movement into it, if it is still flexible enough to move.
These plants with leaflets probably arent the most desirable bonsai specimens, but go for it if you want to try! Maybe you will surprise us all
It will be close to 6 months before you can see the results of whatever steps you decide to take. Time to collect some more trees while you wait!

[Jamie]

pinching doesnt really induce backbudding further down, it increases density at the tips..

i played around with one of these a while back when i was starting they will back bud profusely from hard pruning. the leaf structure can be hard to work with.

give it a crack and see how ya go, remember to post up results!

jamie

[Greenhorn]

thanks jamie i will can't hurt to give it a go all that will happen is i'll learn something my first thoughts were on air layering it because like you said greth the top looks interesting and i really like the nebari it already has so would spring or summer be a better time to begin the air layer? i have already done some pinching lower on the trunk, so hopefully that will work out with a twofa. any ideas how to make something out of the top greth?

[Greth]

I suspect God only knows what to do with that top. Im thinking pick one leader, probably the one to the left, carve away the rest and work with that, probably realigning it to something near vertical along the way, depending on your ideas. Not going to be a quickie job tho.
I have no claims to fame in airlayering, my first is still to be cut off, but has plenty of roots. I'm encouraged enough to try more is all I can say. It all seems a bit esoteric and difficult at first, but the plants seem to get the idea pretty easily!I got airlayer pots, they are called rooter pots, from Garden Express at a not too painful price. Of course you can make your own with a split pot and plastic wrap and ingenuity. The bought ones are purpose built, so less likely to be leaky, but on the minus side, you are stuck with the size, and it doesnt always fit nicely just where you want the layer. They have a water reservoir at the base and a split lid which clips on around the branch very neatly.
Just have a go! Its a pretty cheap plant to replace at worst, and whatever happens with it you can learn something along the way.
No idea on when to try a layer, I dont really know their growing seasons here, and if I did it probably wouldnt be the same as Queensland. I have one my father gave me, dug up from somewhere, it hasnt grown a leaf in a year, tho I know they are usually robust here. No idea what it is waiting for, seems to be just sulking.

[Jamie]

china doll will readily stike from cuttings with out a prob. as for airlayering the trunk isnt massive and the upper section isnt offering a great deal the oly real reason to do an air layer on it would be to get the practice in when you go to air layer bigger and better stuff!

jamie

[Greth]

Thanks for correcting me yet again Jamie.
I was trying to help the newcomer with the plant he already has.

[Greenhorn]

thanks guy's you know what they say practice makes perfect so i'll do it anyway and let you know how it all goes

[Greth]

Good luck, Greenhorn

[Greenhorn]

final question would it do any damage to start the layer now?

[Jamie]

final question would it do any damage to start the layer now?

hi mate

i am always trying to tell people there is always a good time to do it and a not so good time. being that it is rather cool at the moment and trees have slowed down for a while, an air layer now will probably take but it will be a rather long time beofre you got substantial roots on it to detach. if you did the layer mid-late spring it will take about 4-6 weeks instead of a possible 2-3 months if not more.

so to answer you question no it probably wouldnt do to much damage but you run the risk of it failing at worst or taking a long time to get the new root system big enough to support the top.

hope that helps

jamie

[AnneK]

Re the China Doll, at the recent Bonsai By The Harbour, Barry Reeve really attacked one of these with a hand saw doing his speciality of sawing out a wedge and sticking the two halves together again and so obtaining taper. I assume therefore they must be pretty hardy. Barry's tree was obviously older and larger; around 100+ mm diameter and had been an extremely tall tree in a much earlier life.

Regards, AnneK

[Handy Mick]

Hi Greenhorn,
China doll hey? cut the thing down to somewhere at the top of the first picture and treat the same as a nandina.
They are nice and hardy though, like Bretts said, they strike real easy from cuttings, but do this at the right time of year.
No rush, its yours.
Mick

[Greenhorn]

handy mick thank you for that i just got an explosion of ideas when i read that i cant wait to try them. also good to know that they can take quite a beating.

[Greth]

They are tough little guys, and cheaply replaced, try something and let us know how it worked.