pruning encourage trunk growth??

[Shills]

HI. I have been letting my trident maple grow in a grow pot without any pruning as I thought, as some research confirmed, this would be the best way of increasing trunk girth and overall tree size. However, I continually get people telling me that I should be pruning it back so that the energy goes into enlarging the trunk. So what is the truth you thinks?? I want the entire tree bigger, including the trunk.

Cheers,

NIc.

[Luke308]

Good question, I have been wondering the same myself as I have one that is finger think in a grow box. I was under the impression that everything (trunk-wise) below a branch will fatten as long as the branch is growing on. However it is so tempting to take cuttings of those long branches

[Paulneill]

shills
tridents are very fast growing trees i put a pencil sized one in the ground 4 months ago and it has tripped in size . the only pruning that helps trunk thickening is when leaders are involved pruning can be carried out to direct energy to the new developing leader which is left to grow untouched. or when growing trees tall in the garden they could be lightly pruned around the sides with hedge clippers to divert energy towards the top of the tree making it grow taller and the taller the tree the thicker the trunk base. with your trident i am guessing it needs planted in the garden or a larger pot and left to grow and thicken and then chopped back . sacrifice branches can be used as well but are less effective .

[shibui]

A very interesting question. Many years ago when I was new to bonsai one of our more advanced club members was adamant that frequent pruning helped to promote trunk thickening. His reasoning was pruning stimulates more buds to shoot, more buds = more leaves and shoots = more thickness. I'd like to explore this idea more as well.

I grow lots of trees in the ground and generally let them grow freely for a year then cut back hard and repeat. I found that leaving trees to grow vey tall without pruning resulted in telephone pole trunks with large scars that make very poor bonsai. Regular cutting back gives plenty of branches and multiple trunks that will give plenty of options for future trunk lines and when the surplus trunks and branches are removed individual scars are smaller and heal over faster.

A good radial root spread with few vertical down roots is the most effective way of thickening the base of a trunk. Lots of low branches also helps and may even promote radial root spread. I have noted that tall straight trees generally have a few strong downwards roots and few radial surface roots while trees with plenty of low branches usually have more horizontal roots and fewer vertical ones??? anyone else noticed this?

In a pot you need to feed heavily and keep the water up to it to get noticable growth. Putting the pot on the ground and letting the roots escape through the drainage holes works wonders too.

[garywood]

Nic, Quantity vs quality is an age old debate. Everyone's personal preference is just that, personal. One way to evolve your preferences is to do several with with all different techniques. This link is for a more controlled growth with an emphasis on quality'.
http://thingsofwood-gary.blogspot.com/2 ... ocess.html
Wood

[Dario]

Great thread Shibui
Hi Gary, I visited your blog and tried to post this Q via comment section, but I don't have a url.
So...the method is great and so is the developing nebari on the trident!
Gary, at what stage in this process did you sever the original root stock from under the tile?
Is this the extensive root work that is done after 2 seasons that results in the slow top growth, triggering the roots to grow in mass and thereby support the existing shoots?
Sorry Shibui, to focus on Gary's trident...I will contribute later to this thread.
Cheers, Dario.
EDIT very tired, mistakes.

[garywood]

Dario, I don't want to hijack Nics thread but maybe it will be of some help to him also. First root work is after 2 years with the existing roots stubbed underneath the tile and the "new" roots cut back substantially and planted deep to prevent desiccation.
Wood

[Dario]

Thanks Gary for the reply, that s what I thought you ment, looks great by the way!
And certainly did not want to disrupt Nic's thread either, hope all is ok Nic!
And lastly, I was overly tired when I responded last night...apologies to Shills (Nic) and Shibui for mix up of names of the original poster of the thread
Cheers, Dario.
And...Nic here is some info that may assist? It is ever so slightly different to the usual ideas (at least think it is), hope it is of some help?
Article on plant physiology and only quoting a tiny bit at the end of article...hope it is ok to do so.
http://www.bonsaiexperience.com/Physiol ... aping.html
..."For trees growing in nature, the stem size is determined by the amount of
water and nutrients transported through the vessels in xylem and that of
carbohydrates transported through sieve tubes in phloem. In addition, the
stem size should have enough wood to support the tree's weight. For a
bonsai plant, you may neglect the weight issue, so the other two factors are
more important.
Here are some findings from the botanical research.
1)When a single stem branches into two, the cross section area of the
stem before branching is more or less the same as the sum of the
cross section areas of the two branches.
2)The cross section area of a stem is proportional to the total amount of
leaves on the stem up to its end.
Simply put, the more a shoot branches out upwards, the thicker the shoot
grows. So if you want to thicken a shoot, you should increase the number of
branching at that shoot and increase the amount of leaves on it.
For example, to thicken trunk while making “kokejun” (taper), you can just let
more branches grow out of the trunk and let the leaves grow denser.
Meanwhile, you should gradually reduce the amount of branches and leaves
on the shoots as you move up the trunk, and cut off the topmost branches
and leaves. As shoots grow via branching, this method can be applied to any
part of a tree."...end quote.