Nursery Black Pines - Are they worth it?

dansai · Post by **dansai** » July 25th, 2012, 9:45 am

Hi all,

Saw this and at least 2 others at a nursery the other day. They are about 1m high, base of trunk about 3-4 cm, don't have much taper or flare and I have no idea of the roots.

Asking price is $45. Are they worth it? Could something be done with them, like layering some of the tops off, bending, etc, that could make them potential bonsai?

Black Pine.jpg

bodhidharma · Post by **bodhidharma** » July 25th, 2012, 11:54 am

It looks like plenty of potential to me and good at that price. There is always potential with the styles on hand. This could be literati quite easily. In the hands of a good stylist it should be very achievable. Hope you asked the Nursery for permission to use the photo.

Hackimoto · Post by **Hackimoto** » July 25th, 2012, 12:51 pm

Tilt 45 degrees to the right and chop off all the top from the second lot of branching from the base and work on the rest as your tree. Not a problem!

Post by **kcpoole** » July 25th, 2012, 1:04 pm

Take the trunk back hard and do a "Pavel" on it. Wire everything, and bend the heck out of it to compress to a much smaller tree

Ken

Post by **NBPCA** » July 25th, 2012, 1:40 pm

Looks like it might be a "Mikawa" grafted black pine.

Have a look down near the roots and see if there is a graft union.

Reasonable value at $45.

Grant

sekibonsai · Post by **sekibonsai** » July 25th, 2012, 1:49 pm

Forgive my ignorance but what is a "Pavel"?

Hackimoto · Post by **Hackimoto** » July 25th, 2012, 1:51 pm

Pavel Slovac, Bonsai artist.

http://www.bonsaivigi.cz/

dansai · Post by **dansai** » July 25th, 2012, 1:56 pm

Thanks Everyone

I'll have a closer look next time I'm down there and grab 1, or 3, and get some better pics. I haven't had experience with pines other than a few rescued

radiatas so will be asking for some guidance.

I didn't realise you had to ask permission to use photos from nurseries!?

There is also 2 grafted pines there that I can't remember what sort, but one had a graft that was very well healed over and far less noticeable than the other. It had smaller needles and better branches than the black pines. Is the graft something that will become less noticeable over time?

Post by **NBPCA** » July 25th, 2012, 2:22 pm

dansai wrote:Thanks Everyone

I'll have a closer look next time I'm down there and grab 1, or 3, and get some better pics. I haven't had experience with pines other than a few rescued radiatas so will be asking for some guidance.

I didn't realise you had to ask permission to use photos from nurseries!?

There is also 2 grafted pines there that I can't remember what sort, but one had a graft that was very well healed over and far less noticeable than the other. It had smaller needles and better branches than the black pines. Is the graft something that will become less noticeable over time?

Yes

Post by **kcpoole** » July 25th, 2012, 9:23 pm

Hackimoto wrote:Pavel Slovac, Bonsai artist. http://www.bonsaivigi.cz/

As hack mentioned he is renowned for taking collected Pines and Junis and then wiring and bending them into much more contorded shapes.
Antal poste a thread a few weeks ago on his trees wondering whether it was OK.
here is a progression of Pavels on a Pinus sylvestris that show admirally what he does
http://www.bonsaivigi.cz/fotoalbum/gale ... hou-vetvi/

Enjoy
Ken

bodhidharma · Post by **bodhidharma** » July 26th, 2012, 9:09 am

dansai wrote: I didn't realise you had to ask permission to use photos from nurseries!?

Yes you should, you dont have to in Australia, but it is courteous to do so. In some places in Japan they do not let you. There are security reasons (you could be casing the place) some people also just dont like people doing it and it could save you a telling off.

Scott Roxburgh · Post by **Scott Roxburgh** » July 26th, 2012, 12:41 pm

This tree looks like it has great characteristics for bonsai, short needles and dense foliage and it looks quite healthy.

Buy them and plant them in the ground, then take seed and grow some really great Shohin JBP, you'll also be able to sell the seed too!

Look elsewhere for JBP bonsai stock though, this tree has limited potential for bonsai.

dansai · Post by **dansai** » July 26th, 2012, 12:48 pm

Thanks for your advice Scott

Do JBP need two trees to set seed? Are they dioecious? How long until they set seed?

Barry1 · Post by **Barry1** » July 26th, 2012, 1:44 pm

I just took the time to look at that link of Pavel ...thank you Ken ! what a transformation of that pine amazing ; I kept thinking you would almost need an engineering degree to do that

daiviet_nguyen · Post by **daiviet_nguyen** » July 30th, 2012, 8:17 pm

I have a long needle JBP, and not grafted. It is by itself, its seeds are fertile.

When I started out, I bought young and so inexpensive JBP, just around 10 years later, they had flowers and cones while in pots. I killed all the cones.

So, I would guess (I could be completely wrong) at around the 15th year?

Best regards.

dansai wrote:Thanks for your advice Scott

Do JBP need two trees to set seed? Are they dioecious? How long until they set seed?

AusBonsai

Nursery Black Pines - Are they worth it?

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