rules

[craigw60]

Australian bonsai growers seem to have this fixation about rules both for and against. Here are some of my personal thoughts on this subject.
There are no rules we are bonsai artists not sportsmen. There are however some really excellent styling guidelines which for both beginners and experienced growers are well worth knowing about. Whether you follow these guidelines is entirely up to the grower and that persons taste. For myself I don't follow them slavishly but do always keep them in mind when working on my trees. The guidelines for dealing with front and back branches for example I think are very important, great long back branches tend to make a tree look like a peacock in my mind. A long front branch can be very distracting. But please lets try to drop this rule obsession and style or trees as we please always keeping in mind the artistic principals of our craft.
Sorry for the rant but this word has been plaguing me for 25 years and I am really over it.
Craig

[Ash]

This reminds me of a line from the movie 'Pirates of the Caribean spoken by Captain Barbosa (aka the Queenslander Geoffrey Rush otherwise I would consider it too corny to quote) about the Code or Rules of being a Pirate:
"...and thirdly...the code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules. Welcome aboard the Black Pearl, Miss Turner."

[simonm]

the code is more what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules

that is said multiple times in each of the movies, they have some great lines in pirates of the carribean

[Jamie]

this topic feels like de ja vu....


WHERE IS BRETT!!!

[craigw60]

Sorry guys I have not been on this sight for too long and have been bashed with this one a couple of times, just had to say something
Craig

[Grant Bowie]

this topic feels like de ja vu....


WHERE IS BRETT!!!

WHAT? Deja Vu again!

Grant

[Chris H]

I wish I new how to link to a previous topic. Ill Try

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=2354&hilit=rules+where
Search the thread Rules where meant to be broken.

Should cover it all I think.

No need to be sorry Craig, its a topic plenty of us enjoy. Happy reading.

[Jamie]

Sorry guys I have not been on this sight for too long and have been bashed with this one a couple of times, just had to say something
Craig

no prob mate we all have different thoughts and opinions!

hartos has linked the right one, i am pretty sure, it was quite a big discussion but was good, if you feel the need to add to it feel free to it might bring up some more new insight!


jamie

[anttal63]

now im on da floor!!!

[Pup]

OH BUGGER AGAIN Rules smools

I do agree though

[kcpoole]

OH BUGGER AGAIN Rules smools

I do agree though

Agree with what?

that Rules are too strict and people get too antsy about them?

or that we should be applying them to our trees?

or maybe, just do what you like and what feels good, looks good to you the owner?

To my way of thinking, as soon as people see the word "Rule", they should keep their hat on and replace the word in their mind with "Guideline" instead if they need to:-)

I call them rules myself and are happy to do that, and in general apply them to my trees. 'cos I find that the actually look more balanced when I do. If anyone does not like me calling them that the apply the above process

To me, when people use any of the Japanese Style names for a tree, then they should really use the correct "Rules" for that style. eg:
Formal upright means Straight and formal branch placement,
Windswept means having movemeont to one side and the foliage / Branches all heading to the downwind side,
Literati means??? Literati, we have a comp here to learn what that all means do we not?

Ok Knives out and go for it Hornets nest has been stirred now as I think we need another robust discussion

Ken

[Bretts]

You know I am no great artist but I have not heard one explanation in any book or any forum of how I think the rules should be explained. My explanations although seemingly simple just don't seem to be comprehended.

I will use the word most. Most artists become better by learning and studying the techniques of art. Now imagine you are a learned artist. Try to do your work while imagining that you never learnt about the rules of perception. Although even an abstract painting may manipulate or play with the rule of perception it can never be ignored otherwise the painting would be a mess with no meaning.
This is as illogical as saying in bonsai learn the rules and then forget them.
The rules are not a guide they are a puzzle! Unless you are trying to work them out you don't understand them.

Hope that keeps ya's happy

[Pup]

What kept ya Brettles look at espressos tree, still a nice tree though. He is using guidelines as they can be bent, rules are rigid,
Like the law we all know what is right and what is wrong, something at the back of your mind, tells you when you are doing something wrong. Like the guiding hand on your tree's

You know who

[Chris H]

Here we go again.

Its a ripper topic.

Rules change, they change with society, they change with politicians, they change with time.

Art stays with us, the basics of rock paintings in the outback relate to the great masters of Europe and to the Architects of the modern age.

It is the interpretation of the rules which set us appart.

Those like me; who follow the rules for an ok tree or bravely experiment and occaisionally, perhaps by chance, find a great variation......... but mostly bugger it up. As a result we have an ok set of trees.

Then there are those for whom the rules are so within them that they can see the acceptible boundaries.

These people have the instinct for art.

Many of these are here on this forum and I appreciate their ability.

For me, bending the rules is a risk, I love to do it, I cant resist it, the results are unexpected.

I wish I had a better eye (I think its improving) and I admire those that challenge me with a bend to the rules.

I have started to notice that one bend of the "rules" can work; as it creates interest and a counter balance for an otherwise academic line.

Multiple variations from convention are more challenging.

At the end of the day we all are here for different reasons.

For me it is the ability to stand in my yard with a tea, coffee, beer, red wine or naked and look into my benches and see something new. It is very personal.

As such I hope to create trees which connect with me and my family. The rules are rarely consulted, however if I was to do an audit I believe that in general I follow the same guidelines I was taught by Dorothy 15 years ago, and only now am I confident enough to try and change. This forum has given me the confidence.

Thanks Craig for re igniting this topic, it creates thought.

Go for it Ant we are awaiting your view.

[anttal63]

Na!