Water Tank

[Bretts]

Hi Ausbonsai Practitioners,
I have been looking out for a bargain water tank for a while now and Tank World have a great sale on this weekend. They have a range of tanks that after discounts and rebate we can get for around $350.
These range in size from 1000L, 2100L and 5000L
I am considering putting the tank beside the house and connecting to a line that runs out to near my trees(about 30-40m) but I wonder if I would also need a pump. These seem pretty expensive and although sounding stupid I wonder how they work. Does the pump turn on when you turn the tap on?
The other option is to have the 5000L tank at the end of the veranda which is closer to my trees and maybe use a watering can?

Any ideas or insight would be appreciated.
The 5000L tank is actually the cheapest (maybe not after laying concrete to hold it ) and if we get this size I will also consider connecting it to the toilet and washing machine with an extra $1000 rebate.
The Tank World 50% of Sale ends tomorrow if anyone else is interested but they have told me they will extend the deal till Monday for me so I can talk to the Plumber.
Thanks for any help!

[AndrewM]

Gday Brett
The tank will run when the tap is turned on if you have constant power to the pump so you need to look at getting a power source to where you want to put it. Also you don't have to put the tank on a slab you can put down a crusher dust bed for the tank to sit on. I have a 5000 litter tank behind my shed and gravity feed the water. No pump just let the wait of the water in the tank flow out and when it gets to low i use a watering can. Hope this helps

[Mitchell]

Normally you would switch the pump power on when you need the pressure. Just a hose connected to the bottom of the tank will give you atleast a trickle / stream from the pressure of the water in the tank. If you want a blast of water, you'll need a pump though. You may even be able to run a small trickler system from the gravity pressure alone.

[Bretts]

Thanks Guys
I get the feeling a Full 5000L tank will have enough pressure without a pump and if it gets low then only certain trees would get the good rain water so I would not mind so much using a water can for them.

The 2100L tank would be a long way away from my trees(although tucked away neatly) and some how I feel even if it was full it may not be enough pressue to keep me happy.

Thanks for the insight it is helping alot

[Jamie]

ahh dont be fooled thinking the weight of the water will give you goodpressure, i have a ten thousand litre tank and i cant have a hose with a sprayer attachment as the water doesnt have the pressure, a pump is needed, what you want is one of those trench water pumps, it feeds right down to as low as ten-fifteen mm and will have good pressure, cost around 100 bucks for a decent one. they are the same as a grey water tank pump, dont hold the pressure on it though you will burn the motor out.

jamie

[AndrewM]

Gravity feed water has no pressure it just trickles i got my hose running into an old watering can head to spread the flow but if i lift it to high about 1 1/2 meters up the flow turns into a slight trickle. if you want it to spray or have any pressure at all then you need a pump.

[kcpoole]

Weight or volume of water has NO affect on the pressure you get out of a hose
It is solely depended on the Amount of "head" you have, The Head is measured in the water level above the outlet. The higher the difference, the more pressure you get ( Ever notce the towns water supplies are in a tower!)

To get enough Pressure from a gravity system to run a few sprayers, you would need to Tank about 30 Ft above the outlet level.
To get "mains Pressure" you will need to have nearer to 80 - 100ft of head I think back to my water board days

I can get in Sydney a 2500L Round Poly tank and constant Pressure pump for about $350 ( bought 2 when at my old house about 2 years ago).

No need to get fancy about the ground Prep Bretts, I just levelled the dirt, then added a 1/2 layer of sand over it and watered in. Good as gold it was

Ken

[Bretts]

Thanks guys this has helped alot. I think I am getting closer to a decision

[Greth]

We have heaps of header tank pressure, but our header tank is probably about 30-40 metres higher than the house, we have the luxury of space and hills. Actually the valve is half closed otherwise we would water the ceilings whenever we turned a tap on (the previous owners overengineered water pressure) When the pressure starts to drop, about every 6 weeks, it is time to refill the 5000 litre header tank. That is our total water supply for a family of 5, water is stored in 3x 20000 litre tanks attached to the house and both sheds. At an average annual rainfall of about 450 mm, we have only once needed to buy in a tankful of water at the end of summer. Never again, a new shed is going in and the catchment will add 20% to our total. Catchment is currently 120 sq metres on one shed, roughly the same for the house, and maybe another 60 sq metres from the shearing shed. Call it 300 square metresish. 1 sq metre catchment gives 1 litre of water. If we are careful, we can make 350 mm rainfall last a year so 1mm rain= about one days usage. We use water for washing, cooking, I water my seedlings and the shadehouse if necessary, no car washing, no dishwasher, no automated sprinklers, no swimming pools, except a little clamshell wader the girls use on hot days.

Many old tanks were put on a brick platform a metre high, this would give a bit more pressure, but a much bigger building project than just putting it on crusher dust or sand.
If there is any way you could have a tank at roof level and pump it from a low one occasionally you could get more pressure too. Doesnt sound really feasible in a normal suburban house, but I dont know what you have to work with in that way.

[Bretts]

Hi Greth
The first plan was to just buy a 1000L and plonk it under the veranda down pipe. The storm drain of this down pipe needs fixing so it fixed that problem for now and gave me some rain water. But since I figured we can get a 5000L for the same price then it seems feasible that we may even get that and also make use of the government rebate to connect it to the toilet and washing machine.
I had worked out that a rain water tank was going to take many years to pay of with any savings so I should just get what I wanted for my trees and leave it at that. But I did not have access to water tanks this cheap so it is starting to make sense to get the large one and connect it to the house.
The large tank that goes on the side of the house is out of our price range and would just take too many years to pay for itself so I don't think we will go for any on roof setup and we have already considered lifting the veranda a 100 mm or so to accommodate the inlet for the 5000L tank so I don't think we will be raising the tank
Thanks for the ideas though Greth

Is there anyone that has a water tank connected to the toilet and washing machine that can say what they think of doing this?

[Greth]

My dad used to have a washing machine system set up in the 1980's which allowed rainwater for the washing machine, when I call him next I will ask how it worked, I didnt really take much notice when I was in my teens.
Dont pity us for living on rainwater, its clean and pure and we have quickly learned to hate the chlorine smell of mains water. sometimes I just watch the bath filling, and close my eyes and see last winters lovely rain pouring into our bath now.

[FlyBri]

Gday Brettles!

As others have suggested, gravity alone will not give sufficient pressure for your day to day watering needs. Both my 2000L slimline tank and my 5000L round tank have pumps attached, and from memory the pumps cost about $400 each. The pumps power up when you turn on the tap (provided there are no leaks in your pipes, the pumps should not turn on at any other time). The pressure provided is close to mains pressure, and is excellent for using a water wand thingy or nozzle attachment.

When purchasing a water tank it is important to remember that you will pay almost twice as much for a slimline tank as you would for a round tank of the same volume.

Good luck!

Fly.

[kcpoole]

I thought you only got a rebate if you use the tank water to feed the water to the Dunny and Laundry, but this will have to be done by a Lic plumber which most have to pay for, thus negating the rebate?
When I was investigatin it that was the case here any way.

The big problem I see with using tank water for the loo, is if you have a power failure, the pump will have no power so then you cannot fill the cistern after you flush it, you have to then resort to buckets and do it manually. True story, happened to my Mums neighbour when a tree fell over the power lines and they had no power for 3 days. They got tired of carrying buckets of water so they can flush

All I did was 2 2500 L tanks plumbed into a single pump with poly pipe, The pump was left on and when ever you turn a tap on water comes out. Left it plumbed to mny Bonsai bench and hose all the time with tank water at mains Pressure.

Like I say cost me less than $900 for the lot 2 years ago and going to do the same here in a few months at the new house

ken

[Bougy Fan]

Hi All
I know this is getting a bit away from water tank for bonsai - but it is easy to do a toliet for tank water and mains. All cisterns these days have a inlet on each side. The one not used has a blanking plug in it. Remove this and fit a second inlet float valve (Fluidmaster fit easily) then fit an stop cock where it comes in at the bottom of the wall. Then you turn off the mains stop cock and open the tank water one. And if you run out of tank water or have a power failure just turn off the tank water and turn on the mains !


Tony

[Greth]

Great tip, Bougy, will remember that one, always interested in these bits and pieces.
Don't think we get any rebates on water tanks at all, we already completely on our own.