Quality trees not selling?

[Gerard]

In recent days we have seen many posts of good quality trees for sale, unfortunately these trees (absolute bargains) seem to be left sitting with the seller.

Some of the reasons I can see.

*Many of the people on this site would rather grow themselves and not take credit for another persons work.
*Many are daunted by the maintenance needs.
*Others simply do not have large amounts of cash required and choose the 20 year option.
*Some are afraid the tree will die.....can they take a holiday?

I feel that not enough thought is given to the promotion of bonsai for non growers. A centrepiece in a garden, courtyard or balcony. It is not the "done thing" to own just one quality tree.

What is lacking in Australia is aftercare.
A place for a tree to board when people want to take holidays.
Somewhere to go for cleanup, trimming, wiring or complete styling. (take it to an expert or get an expert in for a fee)
Someone to teach maintenance for just one tree, so that in future the owner will be able to do most of the aftercare.

This site probably has dozens of people who would be happy to work on and/or care for quality trees for a fee. Many prospective buyers have no idea how to access such services.

If it was easy to access, many non bonsai people with beautifully manicured gardens and lots of cash might consider buying some of these beautiful trees. Bonsai in Australia can become art which is purchased by non bonsai people.

[Kyushu Danji]

As to why people are not buying some of the bonsai up for sale on this forum, I agree with your reasons, but would add also the fact that there are people on this forum from all over Australia, and it simply may not be practical for a buyer, say in Perth, to purchase something that is from Sydney. There really isn't much anyone can do about this, as frustrating as it is when you see something for sale that is simply too far away to buy.

I think you have a point with the aftercare as well. Until there is more interest in bonsai on a national scale though, there will be little hope of having people devote their time and money to bonsai - whether that be paying for maintenance, or providing that service for a fee. I would love for there to be some sort of nursery that provides care for your bonsai while you are on holiday and such.

James

[Scott Roxburgh]

http://www.ledanta-bonsai.com.au/

In Canberra too!

As I'm sure most would...

[Pup]

Gerard, that is a very pertinent point. I have been asked about this in the past, and I have said I am willing to service the tree when sold.

How much was the answer?.You bring it to me at my convenience, material cost only such as wire soil.
Oh cant you come to me? yes for $30-00 travel cost, OOH that much.

I am willing to do it for any one of my Clients. If there collection is small, and I am available I will board them with mine, too receive the same service as mine, for a small fee.

I think if we have enough people who are willing to offer this service, it will benefit every body. They can post here in an appropriate thread, the location roughly and arrangements can be made through PM-This is then where fees are set.
Trees from Interstate present different problems, but with a service provided by some one who is competent it can be overcome.

The proviso is always, all care taken no responsibility excepted. As you do not know what has happened, previously.

Cheers Pup

[Ash]

The reasons outlined above may be true but I think that a couple of days advertising is far to short a time to say that trees are not selling. Bonsai needs patience, what is a couple of days on the sale bench in the 30 year life of a tree? I don't know of many specialist items of similar value and calibre as the bonsai advertised here that would have sold immediately. Also some of the advertisements are a suck it and see lottery ticket placed by people who know the market very well.

Gerard this topic has certainly highlighted that there are two things we need - a good safe bonsai and bonsai pot courier and good bonsai boarders all around Australia.

Ash

[rowan]

I would be happy to provide service to anyone who needs a bonsai sitter or work done - but unfortunately I live in the middle of nowhere *sigh*.

[bodhidharma]

Aftercare and repotting is always offered at Bodhidharma and a lot of people take me up on it But a babysitting service, now, theres a thought.

[Chris Sirre]

In recent days we have seen many posts of good quality trees for sale, unfortunately these trees (absolute bargains) seem to be left sitting with the seller.

Some of the reasons I can see.

*Many of the people on this site would rather grow themselves and not take credit for another persons work.
*Many are daunted by the maintenance needs.
*Others simply do not have large amounts of cash required and choose the 20 year option.
*Some are afraid the tree will die.....can they take a holiday?

I feel that not enough thought is given to the promotion of bonsai for non growers. A centrepiece in a garden, courtyard or balcony. It is not the "done thing" to own just one quality tree.

What is lacking in Australia is aftercare.
A place for a tree to board when people want to take holidays.
Somewhere to go for cleanup, trimming, wiring or complete styling. (take it to an expert or get an expert in for a fee)
Someone to teach maintenance for just one tree, so that in future the owner will be able to do most of the aftercare.

We provide that kind of service for years and many people take that opportunity. Especially when people buy a larger piece we always suggest it to bring it back when they go on holidays. At a price of $1 per tree per day that is a small price.

" *Many of the people on this site would rather grow themselves and not take credit for another persons work." - That's probably true. I think that's just the "Australian bonsai culture". In Europe and America where many bonsai are imported from China and Japan, bonsai artist do buy those to work on them and refine them or even re-style them. You'll find the same happens in Japan where established bonsai masters buy well established bonsai and further develop them. And isn't that part of the idea of growing bonsai?? You do your part in your lifetime and pass the tree on to the next generation. YOU NEVER OWN A BONSAI!! It's there for you enjoy it and work on it before you hand it over. There are to many people that want to make a quick buck out of selling bonsai. If we want to create a REAl bonsai culture it would be a good thing to start putting some philosophy into your bonsai designs.
I'm more than happy to buy a tree that has been styled by some other bonsai artist. It will be part of it's history even when it might be restyled in the future.

I know this could lead to all sorts of discussions and that's a good thing. I could easily write a book about the issues I do come across but I will see what the reactions are and might put my 2 cents in every now and then.

Cheers,

Chris

[Andrew Legg]

Might I just add that a lot of how a tree sells will have to do with a few things.

1.) You need to get your tree advert in front of someone who is willing to buy it.
2.) You have to convince that person that they are getting a tree they really want.
3.) The price must be right.
4.) Logistics logistics logistics . . .

Now there is/was a tree for sale here recently for the princely sum of $5000. It looks like a very good tree, and I am not going to dispute whether the price is fair or not (mainly cause I don't live in Aus, so would have no idea what so ever), but if I am in the market for a tree costing that much, I want to see clear, well taken photographs against a plain backgroung that shows the tree off to its best (front, back, sides top). I want to know what pot it is in (Japanese? Chop mark?). I want to know a bit about the history of the tree, and how I will be able to get my grubby old hands on it. Its all about marketing folks. The considerable effort that goes into a $5k tree should be reflected in the way it is advertised/marketed.

If I am buying a $30 stick in a bag, then I understand getting a rough photo, but I've seen too many photos here of good trees for sale where I simply can't see the tree from the background. Maybe I am going a bit overboard here, but bad photos really irk me.

All that said, I have just sold a house, and it took a while to sell. I basically had to wait for the right person to walk through the door. I guess as bonsai is art, this is even more so. You have to have a tree that is fairly priced and then wait for the right person. The higher the price, the 'more right' that person is gonna have to be! That can take time.

Cheers

[Ray M]

Hi Chris,
I agree with you about getting trees that are on their way to becoming a bonsai or may already be considered a bonsai. A friend of mine had to give up her collection of bonsai material and offered them to me. I accepted the offer. I would have to say that in all of the material I received I would not consider any of them as bonsai. That said, there are a few trees that have a lot of potential and I have already started working on them. I believe they will turn out to be very nice bonsai. So, what do I do about taking credit? How many of us buy established trees and work on them to make a bonsai? As you said a bonsai is never finished. I have no problems with receiving material and putting my own artistic flavour to the tree to create a bonsai that I am proud to call a bonsai.

Regards Ray

[Scott Roxburgh]

...but if I am in the market for a tree costing that much, I want to see clear, well taken photographs against a plain backgroung that shows the tree off to its best (front, back, sides top). I want to know what pot it is in (Japanese? Chop mark?). I want to know a bit about the history of the tree, and how I will be able to get my grubby old hands on it. Its all about marketing folks. The considerable effort that goes into a $5k tree should be reflected in the way it is advertised/marketed...

The pics may not do a tree justice but when do they ever?

Sometimes the quality of the nurseryman needs to be taken into account, to warrant a further look at the tree in the 'flesh' (or is that bark???). If I was going to buy a $5,000 tree, it doen't matter how good the pics are I'd want to see it in person. I believe that this forum is a means of advertisement, the next step is to go and have a look at the tree in person...

[Andrew Legg]

...but if I am in the market for a tree costing that much, I want to see clear, well taken photographs against a plain backgroung that shows the tree off to its best (front, back, sides top). I want to know what pot it is in (Japanese? Chop mark?). I want to know a bit about the history of the tree, and how I will be able to get my grubby old hands on it. Its all about marketing folks. The considerable effort that goes into a $5k tree should be reflected in the way it is advertised/marketed...

The pics may not do a tree justice but when do they ever?

Sometimes the quality of the nurseryman needs to be taken into account, to warrant a further look at the tree in the 'flesh' (or is that bark???). If I was going to buy a $5,000 tree, it doen't matter how good the pics are I'd want to see it in person. I believe that this forum is a means of advertisement, the next step is to go and have a look at the tree in person...

Agree Scott, but getting people to take the next step is the all important thing. Good clear photos and an engaging sales pitch are all the more likely to attract attention. I think that's probably the point I am trying to make. After all, you don't advertise a business jet with a hand-written tear-off A4 advert at your local petrol station. Nobody is gonna spend $5k by just looking at a single photo on Ausbonsai, but it's the first step in the process. If you lose someone there, there ain't gonna be no second step.

[toohey]

While there are some majestic trees for sale, there are also, in my opinion, some average trees and stock offered on this site for prices some nurseries don't even charge. It is not realistic to try to set some prices for a community(the AusBonsai Community) generally aware of bonsai quality and prices. A better price would achieve sales.
Just my opinion,
Michael

[Matthew]

as for bonsai couriers i moved my collection (almost 80 trees from 10cm to 100cm) from rockhampton QLD to outside wangaratta without a single branch damaged. Thw owner was very familiar with me as i have used him to get expensive trees from nowra and newcastle in NSW to here and rockhampton. I must admit depending on space and distance you may pay abit for it and it wouldnt be worth shipping a $100 bonsai with them over 2000km but for my needs they are fantastic. company is ASK distribution , owner arnold knight and they do most of the eastern seaboard. For say Batemans bay to Sydney area try mark at DRY River Ferns he is good and cheap. i have had no problem with them. I believe once ASK hit brisbane etc they coinside with nursery transport who does all of queensland i beleive. I know red dragon bonsai use/used them with no issues to my knowledge.

[Leigh Taafe]

I have used Arnold from ASK also - even sent a tree from Canberra to Rockhampton - took a week - he provided all care and watering as required. Very professional.