Things we don't much do in bonsai. Why?

[Sno]

mike .nothing is ever free .when your words become abusive or you use words that are demeaning and call it 'free speech' you lose something . People think less of you so your words become not as valuable . There is a time and place to talk about what you are talking about, and as Gavin was YELLING at us bonsai forums are not that place . Please give it a rest .

[baldtwitlion]

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[Rory]

While I appreciate the "natural" style especially some examples that Mike has provided and some trees I have had the pleasure of seeing my Bonsai journey started spending every weekend at a bonsai nursery. I was taught I guess the traditional methods and what to me is pleasing to the eye ie negative space , trunk to apex alignment , left-right-back etc branching for formal and some informal styles . These styles mostly are still proberly the most pleasing to MY eye and I know seeing numerous trees in those styles can seem "cookie cutter" but again I find each one in ther own right unique.

I personally look forward to seeing more Native trees that actually look like Native trees, rather than Japanese replicas, and hopefully discussions like this will help feed that trend. We have a lot to be grateful for, from Chinese and Japanese knowledge, t'would be nice to build on that and grow our own identity.

As Gavin stated

Just some thoughts. If I want my bonsai to look like a tree, I have a loooong way to go.

I suspect we all have a long way to go, however if we're attempting to break the mould, that can only be a good thing, yes?

These are 2 fabulous quotes that pretty much highlight why there is so much passion for the 2 different styles.
Well said from both members.

Regardless of your preference it is nice to appreciate the efforts that members put into both the traditional method, and likewise the more wild/natural look that others strive for.
To say either is poor or of lesser standard could construed as offensive to either.

Remember that so often on paper, words can be interpreted in different contexts. We are all passionate about our views of a perfect world, and this likewise mirrors this forum too.
We are all in this wonderful hobby together and members who have voiced their opinions in this thread have produced beautiful trees.

Maybe we can now move on and bring it back to Gavins original message of trees in the wild, which a lot of us have a great deal of love for.


EDIT: @ baldwitlion, that is a beautiful hollowed trunk on the top right pic. Reminds me of what Grant did with his Banksia recently.
Really old Gums have some of the most striking hollowed trunks in the wild. I'll have to take some pics next time I take the kids for a bushwalk near our house.
I haven't tried my hand at hollowing yet, but I love some of those that have made great examples of them.

[bodhidharma]

This is a yellow box which resides in my front yard. A large tree displaying all you would ever need in a Bonsai.
A huge trunk, cloud foliage, dead wood proportion etc. Put it in a Pot and it would be a different story as you could never miniaturise it and have the same impact.....not with a gum anyway.

[Rory]

Put it in a Pot and it would be a different story as you could never miniaturise it and have the same impact.....not with a gum anyway.

Now thats what I love.... a challenge.

You have slapped me in the face with your garden glove Bodhi, and I happily accept your challenge. Eucalyptus crebra will be my weapon of choice.

If the Gum tree naturally has long internodes, I would say you are quite right in that it will be almost impossible to replicate a great specimen like this in bonsai form.
But with smaller leaf varieties we can only continue to aspire to this great example.

That is a lovely tree Bodhi. Squashed together and struggling for light in a forest it would look remarkably different, but I do love great examples of this Euc that you have posted.

[treeman]

mike .nothing is ever free .when your words become abusive or you use words that are demeaning and call it 'free speech' you lose something . People think less of you so your words become not as valuable . There is a time and place to talk about what you are talking about, and as Gavin was YELLING at us bonsai forums are not that place . Please give it a rest .

You are doing it again. You cannot accuse me of being abusive OR demeaning and then tell ME to give it a rest. Why didn't YOU give it a rest? Why is it you who must have the last word? People can think what they want of me but I'll be damned if I'm going to let anyone accuse me of something I have not done and then tell me to shut up. The lack of rationality with some people is amazing.

[treeman]

It was very presumptuous of you to assume that Sno couldn’t think for himself


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Wrong. And demonstrably wrong. I do not and did not assume he cannot think for himself at all. I questioned whether he thought through his initial claims fully and he then went on to change the details of what he was talking about.
Is that too hard to understand? To make it even clearer for you....you can think for yourself even without considering an argument from all angles due to lack of information, bias due to popular thought and opinion or any other reason.

[Beano]

Maybe everyone can give it a rest. It’s like an episode of MKR in here.

[bodhidharma]

Now thats what I love.... a challenge.

You have slapped me in the face with your garden glove Bodhi, and I happily accept your challenge. Eucalyptus crebra will be my weapon of choice.

Why not a Yellow box Rory
I will wait with bated breath for the result, please remember i am nearly 70 so...................get on with it

[bodhidharma]

Why is it you who must have the last word?

Oh the irony of it all

[baldtwitlion]

It was very presumptuous of you to assume that Sno couldn’t think for himself


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Wrong. And demonstrably wrong. I do not and did not assume he cannot think for himself at all. I questioned whether he thought through his initial claims fully and he then went on to change the details of what he was talking about.
Is that too hard to understand? To make it even clearer for you....you can think for yourself even without considering an argument from all angles due to lack of information, bias due to popular thought and opinion or any other reason.

Condescending


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[Rory]

Now thats what I love.... a challenge.

You have slapped me in the face with your garden glove Bodhi, and I happily accept your challenge. Eucalyptus crebra will be my weapon of choice.

Why not a Yellow box Rory
I will wait with bated breath for the result, please remember i am nearly 70 so...................get on with it

Its funny you ask about that species. I did try quite a few of these and they were excellent bonsai material. Hardy and nice smallish leaves that reduce well, but they were decimated by the possums and couldn't produce new leaves quick enough.
I have about 10 crebras in training but they are young. So as long you don't go demented, I should have some pics for your 80th. And i'll make the pics nice and big for your weary eyes.

[bodhidharma]

Thanks Rory and i appreciate the gesture
OOH.....and thanks for giving me another 11 years of life

[treeman]

It was very presumptuous of you to assume that Sno couldn’t think for himself


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Wrong. And demonstrably wrong. I do not and did not assume he cannot think for himself at all. I questioned whether he thought through his initial claims fully and he then went on to change the details of what he was talking about.
Is that too hard to understand? To make it even clearer for you....you can think for yourself even without considering an argument from all angles due to lack of information, bias due to popular thought and opinion or any other reason.

Condescending


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So to make clear a premise (https://www.google.com/search?ei=lbaiXP ... Ll6VPTTmvU ) is now condescending? ( https://www.google.com/search?source=hp ... f-krxX41zM ) and not just a counter argument. Wow. The reason I used the words ''Is that too hard to understand'' was that I believed my earlier explanation might have been too vague without going back over the whole thing again.

[treeman]

Why is it you who must have the last word?

Oh the irony of it all

The only ironic thing here Bhodi is that you used the word irony incorrectly.